**'S SUB TEST

I was wondering about **'s sublinqual test. Everyone says it's great but it's also said to be non-toxic to the liver. Any chemists around that can explain it?

They are claimed to be non-toxic because they are sublinguial (SP?)...which in theory means they dont go down the regular digestive track..thus avoid the liver...

If it's sublingual, it must have an agent that can carry the test molecule through the lining of the mouth straight into the blood stream. If that's the case, then I'm wondering if this test molecule can still have the side chains (esters) that keep them from leaving the system too quickly.

Why are we assuming here that just because something doesn't go into your stomach, it doesn't hit the liver? The liver filters the blood, not the stomach contents. I am not a chemist, but it's my understanding that what makes orals toxic is the fact that they have to be in the 17aa form in order to be absorbed through digestion. They then enter the bloodstream and collect in the liver where the anabolic agent is freed from the attached 17aa by liver enzymes. Sub-lingual absorption is the next-best thing to IV injection. The mouth is rich with blood vessels and substances that can pass through the thin skin and walls of the blood vessels can be absorbed directly into the bloodstream sublingually, like nitroglycerin for heart patients. If these subs are non-toxic, it's because the anabolic isn't a 17aa form. And, I seriously doubt that there are any esters attached. Once freed from the 17aa, it would be just testosterone. The biggest questions I would want to ask is a) how much test is in it to begin with and b) how much of that is actually absorbed. Whatever was swallowed rather than sublingually absorbed would have no effect at all.

I am by no means a chemist either.....I think it goes directly into the blood stream through the blood vessels in the mouth but does not last more than maybe a couple of hours at most..I guess you are correct that the liver does not only filter things only coming via the digestive track,but then again I dont understand then how injectables do not get destroyed because they are not 17aa.I am fairly sure that the esters on injectables do not prevent there breakdown they are just releasing agents.Just throwing up some ideas.
I think the tabs are 20mg of just pure un esterified testosteroone...but I do not have a clue how much is absorbed.

Anything in pill form can be crushed and slipped under the tongue so why the bad rap for the other orals? I'm not disagreeing. I just don't know!....

Re: hehe

Presser said:

I'm starting to think we have some bright people here on MuscleChemistry,lol, howd that happen,lol

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AAS MAKES U SMARTER!

Re: hehe

Presser said:

I'm starting to think we have some bright people here on MuscleChemistry,lol, howd that happen,lol

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I'm so bright, my daddy calls me "sun".

If I haven't been misdirected in the past, the only reason the 17aa is attached to the androgen in the first place is so that it will be absorbed by the digestive system rather than being destroyed by it. From there, it goes into the blood, and "rests" in the liver until the enzymes remove the 17aa, then it's free-flowing androgen in the blood. That's why you take milk thistle when you're taking alot of orals. Milk thistle protects the liver.

I must say that I'm just repeating what I've been told here. Most things I accept as truth I at least corroborate with multiple sources. I remember what interests me.

So it is just as toxic? Most of the people I know are taking 8 per day. Thanks for all your help although I'm 600 for $100.00 is hard to resist. I won't be doing 8 a day but use it as a base ...maybe 4-5.

To be completely honest....I dont have a clue really.

LMAO!!!!!!!!! it's O.K. though. Like I said it's only a base and cheap! Not only that I'm up for a new job where I will be going between 3 states and I figure it's less of a hassle. I do however appreciate all the input. But I have heard that not all batches are not created equal. Guess I'll know in a couple weeks.

TAGGERT45241 said:

So it is just as toxic?

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I believe we've decided that it IS NOT toxic. The reason being that if it's absorbed directly into the bloodstream sublingually, there's no need for the 17aa that's traditionally attached to an oral in order to be absorbed through the digestive system. It's the action on the 17aa by liver enzymes that makes the other orals toxic to the liver. The question that remains is: How effective are they? How much is actually absorbed sublingually?

By comparison, Andriol is an oral, but it's not a 17aa, so it's not toxic like, say, anadrol. Andriol is testosterone undecanoate. The mfg claims that a significant amount of the test (40mg per gelcap) makes it to the bloodstream, but BB results, or the lack thereof, say otherwise.

** posted that cyclodextrin's suround the test molecule. he posted that it is out of you're system in 1 hour. he said it start's working in 20 minute's. he said it is undetectable in 9 hour's.
i'm taking them now. they speed up my metabolism. i take them in the morning, and i still have insomnia at night.

recumbant69 said:

** posted that cyclodextrin's suround the test molecule. he posted that it is out of you're system in 1 hour. he said it start's working in 20 minute's. he said it is undetectable in 9 hour's.
i'm taking them now. they speed up my metabolism. i take them in the morning, and i still have insomnia at night.

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Isn't the dosage like 1 every 4hrs? I know that most people posting are doing more than that but 4-5 a day is what I heard.

This is from Patrick Arnold who was among the 1st to use s.l. cyclodextrins for prohormone delivery:

How should I take the "Cyclo" products?
The tablets should be taken orally up to four times per day, dissolved under the tongue. No food or beverage should be consumed for at least 20 minutes after the lozenge fully dissolves. The doses should be spread apart as much as possible (i.e. every 4 hours). It may also be advantageous to take a dose before exercising.

I've also heard that it peaks in 20-30min and is "washed out" in 200-240 minutes.

TAGGERT45241 said:

Isn't the dosage like 1 every 4hrs? I know that most people posting are doing more than that but 4-5 a day is what I heard.

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i repeated what ** posted last. he changed how often to take it a couple time's. peaple who made gain's posted that they took anywhere from 8-15 a day. peace. out

I thought that it maybe arond 8. Anyone tried it have any comments?