Need help for a super safe 1st cycle

Hey all bro's here...

Need some input on my 1st cycle coming up next week or 2 weeks...

I am 24, 5'6 currently at 158-160 lbs. Been training for 2.5 years. I was 130 when i was started. South East Asian descent. Live in BC, Canada now. I just had my gyno removed in May 2002. This gyno was present during my teen life and did not go away.

I plan my cycle to be SUPER safe as possible and try to avoid all the strong aromatizing stuff available:

My goal is to gain muscle without much water gain. Probably 10-20 lbs.

Week 1-8: Sustanon 500 mg/week
Week 1-8: Deca 400 mg/week
Week 1-8: Winstrol oral 25 mg/day
Week 1-8: Proviron 50 mg/day

1>. I will take letrozole 1.25 to 2.5 mg per day (week 1-8) to super-minimize aromatization by sustanon

2>. I was quite afraid of using winny after reading some comments by some bros in these websites. However, the reason i use winny is it's tought to have: ANTI-PROGESTIN effects that is caused by deca. I am currently buying some stocks for my future cycle (in 2003), like trenbolone, primobolan (GOOD STUFF... i am planning to have 40 vials this week)

3>. I will also take 25 mg of Clomid from week 1-8. This is to be used as an estrogen antagonist. The reason is that deca will aromatize in another pathway that anti-aromatase like anastrozole or letrozole does not work. I heard that if i use tamoxifen during the cycle, it will decrease strength...

4>. Post recovery plan:
- Will use combo of Nolva 20 mg per day + clomid 50 mg/day for 3 weeks starting week 9.

I am not sure if i should still use the anti-aromatase like arimidex during this time.
For sure i can't use letrozole and nolva together because of drug interaction.

Any input....
Thank you all...
Spoud.

General comments:
Didn't you get the glands removed when you got the gyno removed?
If not, and you still have to worry about predisposition to gyno, it looks like a good cycle, but I would switch the sustanon to a single ester test like cyp or enanthate. The blend of different esters will make your test levels jump around more, and you want them to remain level in order to avoid side effects.

1. In my opinion, .25-.5mg arimidex per day is plenty. Beyond that I think it's a waste of money. But that's just my opinion.
2. I agree with your thinking on the winny, and at that low of a dosage it shouldn't be too hard on your liver.
3. I also agree on the 25mg clomid ED throughout, I do the same thing because it makes it a LOT easier to come off the cycle. Using Nolvadex and arimidex during your cycle will decrease strength and weight gains slightly because it decreases water retention, which is caused by electrolyte imbalances caused by aromatization. You WANT to avoid this. Nolvadex shouldn't be necessary if you're on arimidex, but everyone responds differently to different anti-e's so you might want to have both on hand. IMO arimidex is far superior.
4. Start the clomid therapy 2-3 weeks after your last injection in order to let most of the test clear your system, that way the clomid can do its job. Continue the arimidex all the way through the end of your clomid therapy, it assists in bringing your natural test back online. I have never heard of arimidex and nolva having any bad drug interaction. In fact, a lot of people take them together throughout their cycle.

If you eat and sleep like you should, 20lbs is well within reach with this cycle.

These are just my opinions, if anyone would like to correct me or disagree with me that's cool

1 i thought that when the doc removes the gland that you cant get gyno after that--i read that somewhere

2. running winny for 8 wks ED is going to be hard on your liver

3. clomid should be used post cycle

4. just run the deca and test--thats a good first cycle--maybe run the winny the last 4 wks

5. i wouldnt use the proviron

if you're that worried use EQ instead of the deca

here is a link--sometime too much anti-e actually causes gyno--something to think about--posted by a mod and all around good guy

http://www.fitnessboard.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?topic=29430052&forum=5&22

I just bought some stocks for sust already. From what i read in Anabolics, sust provides more stable levels since some are released faster and some are released slower...

I told my doc to remove the gland but not sure if it's been completely removed but i believe it is VERY hard to remove the gland 100%.

As for the anti aromatase, i am taking letrozole not arimidex. I will only take clomid 25 mg ED and letrozole 1.25 to 2.5 mg ED. Nolva will be taken post-cycle...

Noooo... arimidex and nolva have NO drug interaction.

Letrozole (Femara) and Nolva has!!!

I just don't understand how our body get rids off excess testosterone. If the only way to get rid off it is by converting it to estradiol, then if we block aromatase, we will still have super high testosterone. This means, we will not be recovering our natural T production.

Also, i am worried that once you are off the anti aromatase, estrogen will rebound.

Spoud...

PS: The use of anti estrogen in my mind goes like this:

Week 1-8: clomid 25 mg ED + letrozole 1.25 to 2.5 mg ED (with the reason provided above)

Week 9-10: arimidex 0.5 to 1 mg ED + nolva 10 mg ED (notice i avoid letrozole with nolva because of drug interaction)

Week 11-14: clomid 50 mg ED + nolva 10 - 20 mg ED...

Whoaaa...

Why too much anti-E can cause gyno? What is the mechanism for this?

I think you're being paranoid, no offense. The glands are gone. Just keep it simple and don't worry about the anti-e's too much. .25mg arimidex ED should be plenty, don't know anything about femara, sorry about the mixup.

If you want a super-safe cycle why don´t you use only non aromatizing steroids.................? Primo, anavar, winnie...........

That is true Zeca...

But i have already had some of the stuff with me right now...

I am planning to change it for now since i have to wait for my amp opener, some more primo, letrozole, etc...

My plan is to keep it simple:

My thinking is that: if i want to stack: only one is allowed to aromatize, the other one should not. This is easier to deal with. For example, if i pick sustanon and primo... i am only dealing with estrogen.

If i pick sustanon/deca or sustanon/tren... i will have to deal with estrogen and prolactin.

I will keep my 1st simple... I will try sustanon 500 and primo 600 from week 1-8.

Maybe i should forget about the winny for now ? or maybe do very little dose for 6 weeks like: 10-20 mg per day because it is REALLY bad for the liver.

If i got proviron, i will add it.

I will add letrozole with 1.25 mg ED

Spoud.

Pretty much what the others stated. I would run EQ @ 400mg/wk instead of Deca and leave the Winny out. 500 mg/wk of tet is more than enough for a first go around. EQ has a very low occurance of side effects and if your going to run an anti-e throughout sides effects will be a non issue.


-TAZ

Spoud, before you have your heart dead set on Sus, go and read the post in the Articles of Interest for a different perspective. I don't really agree with you statement on Sus providing more stable levels at 500mg/week but this is just my opinion. Good luck!