Who here Owns or has Owned a GYM??

[Metal85]

I want to start getting more incite on this again.

Around my area there are a lot of regular weight gyms, very few crossfit gyms

It seems like the initial start up for a cross training gym would be far less in cost than a traditional weight gym, and less stuff to break.

I'll like to hear some figures for insurance (I already know how much a pretty good 2 million dollar poliy cost per month)
Minimum sq footage needed
And costs or equipment that may not be coming to mind

 

[The Survivor]

I started as an unemployed ironworker in 1983 with 2 measly tan beds and bought my gym in 1988. Had some damn good yrs but the last 7 or 8 yrs have been pretty bad. That being said, I contracted a consultant to help me thru some financial shit and cross fit came up, per from what he said, its starting to fad out so take that FWIW.

The competition is fierce, back in the 80's & 90's my only compeitor was the local YM, bad enough as they are funded. Now have another huge club, Anytime, a cross fit gym and a few other boot camp places.

Fire away Bro, I'll help as much as possible, keep in mind my facility is kind of hard core, only 7K square feet in a small midwestern city

 

[yellow snow]

I would think that you want a hard core gym with great equipment and good space. Look at planet fitness and all the other dumb ass gyms........it seems like their model makes money. A real gyms seems like it would be difficult to make a living at unless you are buying most everything with cash. I live in a fairly big market and independents are constantly coming and going. The big boys stay because they really don't care about what we care about........they want people that sign a monthly contract then come for two week and stop coming but keep paying their monthly dues.

But then again I have no experience in this type of business, so don't take my word for it

 

[Metal85]

I started as an unemployed ironworker in 1983 with 2 measly tan beds and bought my gym in 1988. Had some damn good yrs but the last 7 or 8 yrs have been pretty bad. That being said, I contracted a consultant to help me thru some financial shit and cross fit came up, per from what he said, its starting to fad out so take that FWIW.

The competition is fierce, back in the 80's & 90's my only compeitor was the local YM, bad enough as they are funded. Now have another huge club, Anytime, a cross fit gym and a few other boot camp places.

Fire away Bro, I'll help as much as possible, keep in mind my facility is kind of hard core, only 7K square feet in a small midwestern city

What kind of sq ft/yr were/are you seeing around you for commercial/industrial lease?

 

[Metal85]

I would think that you want a hard core gym with great equipment and good space. Look at planet fitness and all the other dumb ass gyms........it seems like their model makes money. A real gyms seems like it would be difficult to make a living at unless you are buying most everything with cash. I live in a fairly big market and independents are constantly coming and going. The big boys stay because they really don't care about what we care about........they want people that sign a monthly contract then come for two week and stop coming but keep paying their monthly dues.

But then again I have no experience in this type of business, so don't take my word for it

Can't really use planet fitness as a personal business model. They have 2 million dollars worth of equipment and charge 10 dollars a month.
What I have seen is people pay for boot camps which do not require hundreds of thousands in equipment.

 

[Muscle mechanic]

Where I am there are crossfits, snaps, anytimes, planet fitness. And a couple good one owner gyms. I am talking about 45 mile vicinity. I go to snap personally because I work on calls in different locations.
There is one gym close to my home in rural area. They have tennis courts, tan stuff, sauna, menthol room, basket ball court and Olympic size pool outside open may -Sept.
The one with all the stuff does well. They have summer memberships $275 for families. And monthy family is $65 but only with a two year sign up direct withdrawal. Other wise is $90 month with 6 months min.

 

[The Survivor]

What kind of sq ft/yr were/are you seeing around you for commercial/industrial lease?

I have a rather unique situation, my main area gym in lower level of an old department store, now a mini-mall. This is where I have 5K sq feet, then next floor, I have small (750 sq ft I guess) weight loss center then on 2nd floor is a 2000 sq ft aerobics room that I pay only $50 a month to sublease from the karate guy, he has the evenings and I have access in mornings....

So at one time my entire rent was $1300, dirt f'ing cheap but it wasnt cheap enough so I negotiated with the LL to reduce to $800 which took some doing. My LL does not rent by the square foot, hes old school, he just looks at a price he thinks is fair and goes from there.

So my space is $1.67 per square ft annually to compute it out as most would, which is beyond cheap, BUT there are many issues as I cant install any large sign on building, the lower level leaks when lots of rain or melting snow, so I'm kind of hidden, not good

So sorry to get off topic, I checked with a very small mall about a mile away, and thier price was around $2500 per month, aprrox same sq footage. But outside access there, can put up any signage I want, parking lot steps from entrance etc.....I didnt bite because at $800 per month, plus the cost to build out, the costs to move equipment would be staggering. Like starting over.

There are other spaces in this down town area, they all cheap, maybe not as cheap, I;d say on average probably in the $3-$4 per sq foot range. But like I said, this is downtown district, not retail mall space.

The avg income in this hamlet of 25K, is like $33K a yr, I would imagine yr demographics much different. Beware of the CAM fee, common area maintenance fee which covers snow plowing, mowing, carpet, parking lot upkeep etc that runs additional $3 per sq ft at least in many markets.

The equipment, well the last circuit I bought was cybex VR2 brand new was 20 yrs ago and to be honest, I'm keeping this stuff until the bitter end, its still in great shape, it looks almost new still....the free weights, I buy used on craigs or where ever, I take it home and paint it, make it look acceptable and pay lot less for, so I like that route too, saves a ton of cash

LMK if any more questions, yes my place is hard core BUT most are average Joe's and soccer Moms who chit chat and do cardio as much as I dont like it, but I apprecaite their biz

 

[The Survivor]

BTW I do have both suana and steamroom in both locker rooms, which I would never have added but they were here when I bought the joint. They are a drawing card tho, as no one else has them in town, the maintenece can be a bitch esp the steam room as when it goes down, it can get pricey. The mens gets used more in one month than the womens does in entire yr. In fact, I dont think the womens been used in several months.

 

[Metal85]

Jesus! Talk about dirt cheap bro!for around 5 dollars a sq ft/yr around here you have to be in an industrial area with little to no street lighting at night, and although it's not the worse place in the City, I wouldn't own a place their. My Dad worked on the street and never had issues nor his building, and he used to go in at like 430-530 am, but it's a shit spot. A lot of places here are closer to 9 dollars or easily more... And the charge rate isn't higher than what you are saying. Thank you so much for taking your time out to discuss this with me btw, I really appreciate it Brutha!

 

[Metal85]

also if it is NNN or triple net does that mean there's no CAM?

 

[The Survivor]

Jesus! Talk about dirt cheap bro!for around 5 dollars a sq ft/yr around here you have to be in an industrial area with little to no street lighting at night, and although it's not the worse place in the City, I wouldn't own a place their. My Dad worked on the street and never had issues nor his building, and he used to go in at like 430-530 am, but it's a shit spot. A lot of places here are closer to 9 dollars or easily more... And the charge rate isn't higher than what you are saying. Thank you so much for taking your time out to discuss this with me btw, I really appreciate it Brutha!

They say location location location....I think if you went hard core, you probably get by in a less than ideal location (not saying the one you referred to is OK), but the hard core wont pay yr bills which is shame. Yr chamber of commerce or local economic development department should provide you with the demographics on how many people in a certain radius from a location needed to make it. If you want I can ask my consultant next time I talk w him and see if there is a certain number that is needed to make it and let you know, The dude been in this industry for his entire life and hes gotta be 60 at least

Heres my humble abode (seems like I live here) website http://freeporthealthclub.com/

This yr will make or break me, after 6 straight bad yrs, I have to at least see progress in biz coming back in order to keep the doors open

 

[The Survivor]

also if it is NNN or triple net does that mean there's no CAM?

No, its straight rent, no CAM. I dont worry about my LL taxes, insurance or any other expenses

 

[Metal85]

No, its straight rent, no CAM. I dont worry about my LL taxes, insurance or any other expenses

I found this place 3000 sq ft right next to the biggest engineer place around (govt contracts, communications, space shit etc)
However its 6sq ft/yr which equals 1500 a month, before electric, cable etc. The CAM is actually incorporated in that price, but I'd have to immediately have at least 16 customers paying 100 a month to just break even, on a 2 year min lease.


As far as the certain amount from your consultant, asking def wouldn't hurt. Probably at least 800 people work right across the street, but more total in the company, which has a multitude of buildings within a 1/2 mile radius

 

[Metal85]

BTW Survivor that looks great!
I like it a lot my man!

 

[Presser]

I have 2 good friends whom own gyms now and another buddy just bought a new gym in Florida, and I knew another guy years back who owned a decent gym, all of them said the same thing, you make your money on the Supplements you sell there, and the shakes and shit you make behind the counter, thats where the money is at!

I know another guy who owns a Crossfit gym and they have been breaking even for years now, and he reached out to me last year about selling Supplements there in his crossfit warehouse as I suppose he figured out that is where you make all your money.

Crossfit is fading no doubt about it!

Personally, I would go with a NICHE type of gym, and my niche would be the Hardcore lifters! As they are loyal, and they feed their bodies with supplements you can sell at the gym. And Personal Training out here in Jersey has been phenomenal money making machine for the last 17 years, as I know guys who have brand new Nazi Sleds and Jags, not to mention New Houses all built from PT money. I don't know how the market is in other states for Personal training, but I know out here it is huge.

Anyhow, I think you need a hardcore gym these days to make money, as you can not compete with Planet fitness or Retro for that matter, and Retro needs to see 1 Million Dollars in Assets before they even let you look at the Franchise paper work lol,

If it were me, I would go with a Bodybuilding Dungeon that smelled like free weights, chalk and rubber matting when you walked through the door!

 

[Metal85]

I have 2 good friends whom own gyms now and another buddy just bought a new gym in Florida, and I knew another guy years back who owned a decent gym, all of them said the same thing, you make your money on the Supplements you sell there, and the shakes and shit you make behind the counter, thats where the money is at!

I know another guy who owns a Crossfit gym and they have been breaking even for years now, and he reached out to me last year about selling Supplements there in his crossfit warehouse as I suppose he figured out that is where you make all your money.

Crossfit is fading no doubt about it!

Personally, I would go with a NICHE type of gym, and my niche would be the Hardcore lifters! As they are loyal, and they feed their bodies with supplements you can sell at the gym. And Personal Training out here in Jersey has been phenomenal money making machine for the last 17 years, as I know guys who have brand new Nazi Sleds and Jags, not to mention New Houses all built from PT money. I don't know how the market is in other states for Personal training, but I know out here it is huge.

Anyhow, I think you need a hardcore gym these days to make money, as you can not compete with Planet fitness or Retro for that matter, and Retro needs to see 1 Million Dollars in Assets before they even let you look at the Franchise paper work lol,

If it were me, I would go with a Bodybuilding Dungeon that smelled like free weights, chalk and rubber matting when you walked through the door!

I like that a lot too!
A lot of start up capital, but that is the type of gym I always saw myself possibly having if any.

 

[The Survivor]

Wow I must be in a really bad area, the PT in my place is almost non-existent. I really dont care to do it, I like helping people but chances are most people blow the diet anyway, so thier results are minimal. There is a guy here in this city who does a lot of PT and he has to wash windows and work at a retail store to make ends meet, this is a dollar store town.

The products and supps I do sell some of, its hard for a bricks & mortar to compete with online companies as they can get cheaper prices and delivery usually within 3 days. My profit after I pay my manager 10% commission on is pretty small but adds up to at least pay some expenses.

Owning a gym can be a thankless job, is the Winter you cant get people out of here and the summer you cant get them in. Its also at least 70 hrs a wk job, 7 days a week and at times I feel isolated when no one here but I battle that pretty good. Just being self employed in a recession and laying there awake in bed wondering where yr next dollar is gonna come from is stressful. I really would have to think long & hard if I would do it over as the corporate and big box places are putting a hurt on the indepenant gyms

I like the niche marketing idea assuming yr in a large enough market, I've heard of big cities hard core gyms getting a premiuim dues to keep the ordinary members out. If I did that, I'd be closed in no time at all.

 

[Metal85]

Wow I must be in a really bad area, the PT in my place is almost non-existent. I really dont care to do it, I like helping people but chances are most people blow the diet anyway, so thier results are minimal. There is a guy here in this city who does a lot of PT and he has to wash windows and work at a retail store to make ends meet, this is a dollar store town.

The products and supps I do sell some of, its hard for a bricks & mortar to compete with online companies as they can get cheaper prices and delivery usually within 3 days. My profit after I pay my manager 10% commission on is pretty small but adds up to at least pay some expenses.

Owning a gym can be a thankless job, is the Winter you cant get people out of here and the summer you cant get them in. Its also at least 70 hrs a wk job, 7 days a week and at times I feel isolated when no one here but I battle that pretty good. Just being self employed in a recession and laying there awake in bed wondering where yr next dollar is gonna come from is stressful. I really would have to think long & hard if I would do it over as the corporate and big box places are putting a hurt on the indepenant gyms

I like the niche marketing idea assuming yr in a large enough market, I've heard of big cities hard core gyms getting a premiuim dues to keep the ordinary members out. If I did that, I'd be closed in no time at all.

The funny thing is we are well out of a recession, just
companies are still pretending they are in one to give reason to skeleton crews
and shitty work conditions. "you're lucky to have a job" when working a career in healthcare that you did 90-110 hour weeks to get through school is not luck,
People didn't stop coming in either. There are also tons of manufacturing companies doing extremely well again that use the same line of BS.
As far as products you sell I could def see how LA fitness Anytime Planet Fitness really screw you, and how online supps also are really hard to beat.
What if you did your own labeling and bottling? Bought protein and BCAA's in bulk, add fillers like every other company does, and than sell it that way?
Have you looked into that?

 

[LeatherHead]

You hit the nail on the head brother. The big gyms rely on the fact that most that sign up will not come for long but forget to cancel via certified and registered mail. I was talking to one of the managers at one of my gyms that i goto, and he said HALF of their income is from people who don't even check in.

 

[Ashikabi]

I started as an unemployed ironworker in 1983 with 2 measly tan beds and bought my gym in 1988. Had some damn good yrs but the last 7 or 8 yrs have been pretty bad. That being said, I contracted a consultant to help me thru some financial shit and cross fit came up, per from what he said, its starting to fad out so take that FWIW.

The competition is fierce, back in the 80's & 90's my only compeitor was the local YM, bad enough as they are funded. Now have another huge club, Anytime, a cross fit gym and a few other boot camp places.

Fire away Bro, I'll help as much as possible, keep in mind my facility is kind of hard core, only 7K square feet in a small midwestern city

Midwest? Where you at?