growth factor cocktail......proud13!

Hypothecially, all money problems aside.....is it possible to have Fibroblast Growth Factor, Vascular Endothelial Growth Factor and Insulin Like Growth Factor all mixed in one slin pin? Just mixed in the pin long enough to draw them out of each individual vial into one pin, then inject right away? WIll these have a negative effect if introduced to each other, or would the be fine for say, no more than one minute in the same pin?

E

What are Fibroblast Growth Factor, Vascular Endothelial Growth Factor and were can I get them?

I've looked into FGF but can't find a usable human dosage. That is the problem with most cytokines. They're experimented on rats and mice and to even convert the dosages into what a human would take it would be ridiculous b/c they give those rodents mega doses.

As for the vascular endothelial growth factor...I'm not too sure what that is but it sounds like it has some thing to do with the bronchioles or lung tissue.

I've put IGF and slin (40mcg IGF/10 IU slin..postworkout) in the same pin before without any probs and still got the efx of both so I don't see how they would react differently or destroy each other.

I have heard that slin in the presence of GH though can shorten the life of the GH but I've never looked for a study to see whether that is true or not.

To answer your question-I'm unsure of what would happen esp. since there are no studies on the combo you mention nor would there probably ever be. I don't think that there would be any negative effect since they're all cytokines and don't compete for the same receptors nor are any binding proteins. I would compare it to something like synovex they give cattle and how it is propionate and estradiol (two sex hormones) and both work in the same way they would if presented by themselves, therefore both efx are seen in the animal leading to larger, heavier cattle.

yeah

yeah, its just a theory.....i've been reading up on all the different cytokines......in muscle tissue.....these all seemed to play a role in hyperplasia.....so i figured if it can be affordable....why not use all of them.....the EGF is supposed to increase the production and the repair of endothelial cells and lining.......from what i've gathered....the IGF-1 works best when there are already optimal amounts of these other two cytokines....again...i'm no biochemist...just a theory.

E

Yeah it's a good theory. Just think of the first guy who stacked GH and AS together or better yet IGF and AS together or IGF, GH and AS together.

I almost did PGF, IGF, slin and AS together but never ordered the PGF. However, I did do IGF, slin, AS and GH together... my tummy said "no likey" unfortunately when my muscles were saying "hell yeah".

I found a study on stanozolol which showed it increased collagen synthesis but I can't find it anymore. I bet if winny and GH were run together for about 2-3 months you would have some strong ass joints though.

EJA1979,
Good to see you read those boards like me and I'm not the only dork. NCBI, blackwell, etc, etc.. Einstein1905 is another person who reads up on those and knows his shit too.

Hey guys, I'm new here but know quite a bit about some of these things you're talking about. On the VEGF, it's a plasma membrane mediated growth factor that initiates, what I believe is a G-protein coupled receptor (If I'm wrong it's a Receptor Tyrosine Kinase) -- Sorry I haven't had basic cell signaling in years! -- that triggers a kinase/phosphatase cascade that ultimately causes cell proliferation on the endothelial lining of blood vessels. Basically, it kickstarts the cell cycle and gets mitosis going on the endothelial lining of blood vessels.

EDIT-- I thought about it for a few minutes, and it is indeed a receptor tyrosine kinase so you probably have a MAP cascade occuring.

Re: yeah

EJA1979 said:

yeah, its just a theory.....i've been reading up on all the different cytokines......in muscle tissue.....these all seemed to play a role in hyperplasia.....so i figured if it can be affordable....why not use all of them.....the EGF is supposed to increase the production and the repair of endothelial cells and lining.......from what i've gathered....the IGF-1 works best when there are already optimal amounts of these other two cytokines....again...i'm no biochemist...just a theory.

E

Click to expand...

While it's true that cytokines do play a role in the signaling hyperplasia, (and in chemotaxis in the event of chemokines) the ones you're talking about here (EGF and FGF) are going to exert the majority of their effects in the skin. It's neat to treat skin fibroblasts with EGF and watch them with IF microscopy, because you'll see all the actin filaments in the cell rearrange, the cell will round up, and the cell cycle begins.