Growth Principles for Beginners

megatron said:

i would like to know more on the work out section i am interested in the 3day principle . i agree with the rest between workout days i just dont know how 1set on each exercise is enough and how you can work chest and shoulders in the same day.im allways open for advise i would like to to talk with you some more big A if you would i think the rest thing would be something that could help me i think i might over train a bit.

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The set is one WORK set to failure. That means the set has to be intense enough, that the muscle PHYSICALLY fails at the end of that set.
You will find that a PROPER WORK set will have the muscle under more time under stress than several sets of standard training mode.

buildit303 said:

Wow. I've heard of this kind of training in the past. Think it was on trulyhuge.com.

Is this split into two workouts per day? Or all done at one time? How long does it take to get thru it?

Big A, do you use this routine, with variations of exercise to keep from stagnating, all year round, i.e. same 3-day per week schedule all year round?

Thanx.

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This is all based on HIT principles. Wherever you read about it, is just HIT rehashed and modified various ways.

The workouts are only once a day. If you do twice daily workouts, that will stress the nervous system too much and as such drain your recovery ability too much.

The workouts are under 1 hour. Legs and back take longer than chest as rest periods are longer as you are trying to recover after heavy work sets with squats, deadlifts, etc.

I use the same routine year round, apart from competition time, where everything I do is geared to losing maximum fat in minimum time. The muscle is kept by gear and diet.

For variation, I do slight changes - incline barbell gets replaced with flat db press and flat flyes with incline flyes, etc.

Who told ya that Paul Dillet didnt train with any intensity??? HAve you ever trained with him personally to know whether this to be true or not??? I've been in the same gym with him in Atl (back in the day) and he didnt half ass his training.

Big A - this post is great. The one thing for everyone to remember is that it can't cover everythign in that short space, so newbies wouldn't want to use that same amount of gear, and more experienced folks might want to use more (if they need to do that).

I have read some research studies that suggest you can push out more strength increases by lowering the weight/increasing the reps with more regularity than most of us (or at least *I*) do. I HATE lowering the weight.

For my "warm up" sets on things like the squat, bench or military press, I use a smith machine and about half the normal weight and try to do it as fast as possible (sort of a power lifter approach). Helps work on spead and power a bit and I can convince myself that it isn't really a "warm up" but useful on its own. Doesn't entirely remove the warm ups though...

I know younger guys than I who are on HRT, so I also would agree that the risks of being "on" might be overstated if you get tests done regularly. For the short term, you need to make sure you don't screw up your liver and die. For the long term, you want to make sure your cholesterol doesn't get so out of whack that you get a heart attack or stroke in ten years. I would also add monitoring your BP to the list of things to do. I would also suggest using liver sups even if you are on orals.

I think that if you monitor what you take and how your body is doing, you can modify things and get into a nice, relatively safe groove that works with OUR body.

Great post

Your natural test levels can shut down before weeks, it all depends on how suppressive the compound/compounds your using are and their respective half-lifes.

And yes it is a well known fact that you shouldn't believe the routines that pros write in the magazines, more often than not they will lead to over training. So about your comment about the short acting esters, are you saying that you ONLY gain water weight during the first 4 weeks of a cycle? I have personally witnessed this NOT being true.

I would go for the short cycles because they are generally easier on the HPTA and therefore gains made on them, while they may be smaller will be MUCH more easily maintained post cycle. I mean what's the point of being on for 6 months, making impressive gains only to have a good chunk of them be lost post cycle because of your body scrambling to return to homestasis? That is why EVEN if i was still growing and my blood tests were fine i'd come of and give my body some down time, before going back on shortly after.

Anyone that has tried a powerlifting routine will tell you strength and size comes quickly. It took me many long years of lifting to realize less is more. My greatest benefits have come on 4 day a week workouts in the 4-6 rep range, the problem is its difficult to continuely workout that way, thats why I only do it 4 times a year for 6-8 weeks at a time.

this post is awsome!!!!! the way big A is training is basically the same as Mike mentzer, and also Dorian yates who i regard as having the greatest all round muslcular frame in bodybuilding. I personally have tried this way of training but the problem is say i get 2 plates on for 6 reps, i never seem to be able to go further than 6 reps my 1 rep max never gets higher, this has absoloutley kicked me in the teeth and really got me in a very deep depressed rut, since then i have realised im not cut out for being a bodybuilder so i concentrate more on looking lean and fit, im still going to do the odd cycle, just im not as obsessed with bodybuilding as i was before. Other than that big A cheers for the info and i wish you all the best in your bodybuilding career.

Chaps said:

Your natural test levels can shut down before weeks, it all depends on how suppressive the compound/compounds your using are and their respective half-lifes.

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With the androgenic compounds (testosterone) it takes towards 4 weeks to shut down your HPTA - this is medical fact, not crap that is written on a board somewhere.

Chaps said:

So about your comment about the short acting esters, are you saying that you ONLY gain water weight during the first 4 weeks of a cycle? I have personally witnessed this NOT being true.
.

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You have not even done your first cycle yet, so how can you see you PERSONALLY witnessed this?

Chaps said:

I would go for the short cycles because they are generally easier on the HPTA and therefore gains made on them, while they may be smaller will be MUCH more easily maintained post cycle. I mean what's the point of being on for 6 months, making impressive gains only to have a good chunk of them be lost post cycle because of your body scrambling to return to homestasis? That is why EVEN if i was still growing and my blood tests were fine i'd come of and give my body some down time, before going back on shortly after.

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If you do your cycle properly and then your pct properly, you will be recovered just as quick after a long cycle as a short one.
If you do HCG every 4 weeks while on, when you come off, regardless of time on, doing a proper pct, you will be back to normal within 6 weeks.
It will also take you just as long to recover if you do a 6 week cycle of short esters. Once your HPTA is shut, it's shut.

I can say i've personally witnessed this BECAUSE i've seen my buddies who regularily cycle AAS making gains in the first 4 weeks.

Chaps said:

I can say i've personally witnessed this BECAUSE i've seen my buddies who regularily cycle AAS making gains in the first 4 weeks.

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OK, what you see are water 'gains' inside the muscle. A lot of the initial weight gains are water under the skin but a lot is water in the muscle as well.
Muscle is 70% water. Steroids increase water levels outside and inside the muscles. But those are not 'real' muscle gains, as in the protein muscle formations haven't happened yet. Those gains are the same as creatine water gains - as soon as the person is off the gear/creatine, the water from within the muscle goes away and no benefit is left thereafter.
Doesn't mean it happens in 100% of the people as of course that is impossible due to individuality issues, but 95%+ of people do indeed get water gains only in the first 4 weeks, approximately.

Go on a 4 week cycle of anything you wish. Then stop it exactly 4 weeks later and see how many gains you will keep.

My first cycle is going to be a 4 weeker actually, so i'll post my results once i run it in september.

guys

Hey Big-A !!!!!!!

guys I think some dont get that each excrcise has warmups i.e like so: I'll use my flat bench for example:
Bench: 4 sets
135lbs or 2 plares one a side x 10 reps
225 x 10 -25- reps
315 x 10-15 reps
405 x 10 (sometmes just skip to 465 straight)
465 x 6 reps (last one is what everyone calls teh work set, though the preceeding 3 were your WARM UPS sets, i think the ONE WORK SET thing confuses the hell outta people

That is all this is pretty much guys, the initial 1-3 warm ups is A- to get the proper groove on the excercise IMO and B- to get the muscle warmed up a little before hucking around near your max weight on that excercise for 4-6 reps

Big-A no what do you say of advance dguys like myself, I am around 250 now I seem to do well off high volume
typically i'll do 4 sets each about 5 excercise per body part , again i'll use chest as an example:
Flat:
135 x 20
225 x 20
315 x 16
405 x 10 lst work out i did
465 x 4 no spot
Incline Dumbells:
165lb'rs x 15
165's x 15
165's x 12 (biggest dumbells we got)
Decline Dumbells:
165 x 10
165 x 10
165 x 8
Flyes:
100's x 10
100's x 10
100's x 8
100 x 6
Crossovers just to finish up !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

my questions are on bench of course I can go up, i have been well above 500lbs for reps many time, so i know that but what do i do as for dumbells ?
I no longer do incline bar as it just screws up my shoulders royally seems to cuase impengements
my prob is if I can do thes ereps with these weighst were do i go on anything accept bar excercises amd if I cant go giher in weight then should I continue with more sets till i can ?????????

iwhat is your tak on Ronnie does he really train 6 days a week like they say ? I have abro that knws him that I can ask and get the truth I guess just curious of your expert opinion on the matter

take care !

Chaps said:

My first cycle is going to be a 4 weeker actually, so i'll post my results once i run it in september.

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Really bad idea, I dont need to know what ur taking to know u will put on probably 15 pounds during that month but you will be upset when you piss it all out over the next two weeks. Muscle takes time to grow and the initial 10-15 can absolutely be 100% water, unless ur starting at something tiny like 140. Four weeks??? WASTE!!

Your body has to grow other things besides muscle to support new muscle tissue, like blood vessels, sure you can look more veiny after only a few weeks of tren but that is mainly due to the increase in total blood volume and BP, its not new blood vessels.

Think about it 4 weeks wont do shit. I dont get why people with no experience always decide that they know better than people who have seen some shit, do yourself a favor and go for at least 3 months on cycle number one, when you are done you will be well pleased.

BigA I got a question on this thread.

You posted about bloodwork and what to do regarding certain tests that may be out of range.

What about RBC? It seems that 750mg of test will throw off the RBC of anyone (i could be wrong there) but especially if the anabolic used is EQ it seems an even greater risk of having your RBC out of wack. If this is the case, do you simply ignore it since we know the cause, or is this something that needs to be addressed. I just dont know of anyway of lowering it without dropping the doses of test of dropping eq all together.

Mine is almost always a little high when on, other than that Im in the normal ranges even for liver enzymes. What do you think?

DOCTREMBLAY said:

my questions are on bench of course I can go up, i have been well above 500lbs for reps many time, so i know that but what do i do as for dumbells ?
I no longer do incline bar as it just screws up my shoulders royally seems to cuase impengements
my prob is if I can do thes ereps with these weighst were do i go on anything accept bar excercises amd if I cant go giher in weight then should I continue with more sets till i can ?????????

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Get the gym to make you bigger dumbells - 200lbs or move to another gym that has them. Otherwise, yes, just stick to bar exercises.

body2see said:

Unless you are using gear, then such a workout routine would be without question overtraining for many. I think it goes back to the fact that what works for one, will not work for another. Simple as that. If you are taking 1g+ of test per week, obviously your body is going to have a significant positive nitrogen retention, on top of all the other positive factors going into quicker recovery times. Let's not forget that there are several users here who remain natural bodybuilders. For such members, overtraining is a key factor to take into consideration.

As for the main question posed here...."If your blood results come back positive, and your receptors are still active, why should you come off??"

-Common sense would tell us that the more foreign substances you put into your body, the higher degree to which it throws off your entire system. If this weren't true, then why would people use selective dosages?? People stay within boundaries for safety reasons. Just because your body can handle 1g+ of test, massive amounts of insulin, HGH, etc...does not give you a license to put it into the body without consequence. Sure, maybe the blood work is fine "for the moment". The human body can take a beating...but don't think for a moment it is not having a negative effect on your body. Somewhere in the body you are catastrophically effecting something. Do not think that extended high blood pressure levels, constant strain on the kidneys, liver, and other internal organs will not catch up to one down the road. A test is "at the moment". It does not show what will happen in a week, it will not show that your kidney, liver, and heart can fail at any moment. This is why most normal people tend to use shorter cycles, to save face, and save possible health consequences. There is no rocket science behind this. All the gear bodybuilders use will have a detrimental effect if abused, anything will, hell people die from ibuprofen. Good bloodwork is not a license to go crazy, minus consequence, unless of course one has a deathwish, and purely thinks about living one day at a time, without thought for the future.

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It is a common misconception that if one uses steroids they can train harder than natural. Not so. While yes, steroids to increase recovery ability, they greatly increase strength very quickly, which means more damage done to the muscles each workout, which means that the body needs the extra recovery ability from the streroids so it does not become overtrained.
You have to keep in mind that over a persons training life, their strength can increase 6 times while the recovery ability increases only 2.5 times.
The above aorkout is great for naturals too. It originally became designed as a natural's workout.

Blood tests are used in medecine to see possible future problems as before anything goes wrong with an organ, signs can be detected through blood tests for a very long time in advance, years even. So doing a blood test every 6 weeks or so will give you plenty of warning.

You said highblood pressure - if a person doesn't eat like a moron, the blood pressure stays normal. Mine is always 120/80 regardless of how much gear I use because I watch the diet.

You said liver and kidneys get stressed - most injectibles have ZERO negative effects on the liver. Check any medical journal. For the toxic compounds, one is supposed to take liver aids. If Synthergine is taken with any aa17 compounds, the liver will not be under stress, unless the person is a moron and also drinks and takes rec drugs.
The kidneys will be fine as there's only 1 or 2 steroids that 'could' possibly be kidney toxic. Most kidney problems are because people get dehydrated because they don't drink water. Soft drinks, etc do not hydrate.
Also, I recomend Proscar for keeping the prostate healthy, Femara to keep estrogen levels in check and regular HCG or CLomid to keep the testes functioning.
The heart is kept healthy with intense cardio, fish oils, aspirin, etc. And of course, if one is worried, they should get MRIs done when they do the blood test.

Ibuprufen is more liver toxic than paracetamol which in turn is more liver toxic than ANY steroid, including d-bol, a-50 and halo.

I do not support abuse of steroids, but if done the way I suggest, then that is not abuse.

AZ1 said:

BigA I got a question on this thread.

You posted about bloodwork and what to do regarding certain tests that may be out of range.

What about RBC? It seems that 750mg of test will throw off the RBC of anyone (i could be wrong there) but especially if the anabolic used is EQ it seems an even greater risk of having your RBC out of wack. If this is the case, do you simply ignore it since we know the cause, or is this something that needs to be addressed. I just dont know of anyway of lowering it without dropping the doses of test of dropping eq all together.

Mine is almost always a little high when on, other than that Im in the normal ranges even for liver enzymes. What do you think?

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Generally, most people are aenemic, so the gear will optimise their RBC. That being said, 150mg/day of aspirin helps blood flow. There are also all the blood thinners and those drugs that make the blood cells more slippery, but if you need to use those, then your RBC is abnormally high to begin with which means you shouldn't be using steroids in the first place.

Big A I just have to say you have GOT to be one of THE most patient people on these boards.

When I read some of the responses they have me pulling my hair out but you just answer in your usual calm factual matter. Ah to be 21 again and to know it all


CROWLER

CROWLER said:

Big A I just have to say you have GOT to be one of THE most patient people on these boards.

When I read some of the responses they have me pulling my hair out but you just answer in your usual calm factual matter. Ah to be 21 again and to know it all


CROWLER

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Hey, did I tell you that I am 5 for 5 in the Supreme court now? Out of the five cases (mine was first obviously), I have won five, all unanimously

In the Supreme court, you don't argue just with the prosecution, you argue with the whole bench (3 Supreme court judges) as they throw questions at you in the middle of your arguments and it's up to you to convince them (the judges) that there was a mistake of law that took place.

So far, I've won every case and in the first one (mine) I actually made a new law as I set a precedent, which I succesfully used in another case that I won.

Right now I am working on the sixth one, which is actually Constitutional law. I'll be arguing 5 grounds of Appeal, 3 of them being that the law regarding this particular issue is unconstitutional. Will be fun

So yes, I have become accustomed to arguing calmly. That way the other party makes mistakes and if you are calm you get to see them.
Here on the boards, it's really easy when you have facts to back you and all these young pups think they know what they are talking about. At least I try to set them straight, because as you said, most of the experienced guys can't even be bothered arguing with them.

Big A said:

Hey, did I tell you that I am 5 for 5 in the Supreme court now? Out of the five cases (mine was first obviously), I have won five, all unanimously

In the Supreme court, you don't argue just with the prosecution, you argue with the whole bench (3 Supreme court judges) as they throw questions at you in the middle of your arguments and it's up to you to convince them (the judges) that there was a mistake of law that took place.

So far, I've won every case and in the first one (mine) I actually made a new law as I set a precedent, which I succesfully used in another case that I won.

Right now I am working on the sixth one, which is actually Constitutional law. I'll be arguing 5 grounds of Appeal, 3 of them being that the law regarding this particular issue is unconstitutional. Will be fun

So yes, I have become accustomed to arguing calmly. That way the other party makes mistakes and if you are calm you get to see them.
Here on the boards, it's really easy when you have facts to back you and all these young pups think they know what they are talking about. At least I try to set them straight, because as you said, most of the experienced guys can't even be bothered arguing with them.

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Supreme court, legal precedent, Constitutional law ????????

And all these years I thought you were just a big muscle head


BTW impressive as heck. :thumbsup:



CROWLER