High reps build muscle?

klowndog

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Conventional wisdom has it that training with high reps and light weights builds endurance, but makes little contribution to gains in muscle mass.
Heavy weights and low reps has long been the accepted “best way” to maximize muscle growth.
Back in 2010, Stuart Phillips, a kinesiology professor at Canada’s McMaster University, began to overturn much of that conventional wisdom.
[h=3]Does High Rep Training Build Muscle?[/h]Phillips and his team found that muscle protein synthesis, a key driving force behind muscle growth, was higher with light weights and high reps (4 sets of 24 reps) than it was with heavier weights and lower reps (4 sets of 5 reps) [6].
At the time, these findings generated a lot of controversy.
They were also dismissed by many, mainly on the basis that the study looked at short-term changes in protein synthesis rather than long-term gains in muscle size.
So, Phillips set up another trial.
This time, he got a group of guys to train their legs on the leg extension machine three times a week for 10 weeks, using one of three different set and rep configurations [2]:

  • 1 set of 10-12 reps performed to voluntary failure
  • 3 sets of 10-12 reps performed to the point of fatigue
  • 3 sets of 30-40 reps performed to the point of fatigue
The amount of new muscle added to both legs was almost identical. Training with lighter weights and higher reps stimulated just as much muscle growth as heavy weights and lower reps.
What’s more, the average size of both the fast and slow twitch muscle fibers increased equally with heavy and light loads, meaning that both fiber types were recruited and stimulated during training.
[h=3]Do High Reps Build Muscle in More Advanced Lifters?[/h]Once again, this study attracted criticism, most notably because it used untrained beginners as subjects.
Take someone who’s never exercised and get them to lift weights for a few months. They tend to grow no matter what they do.
Are you going to see the same results in guys who have been training for a few years?
To find out, Phillips recruited a group of 49 men with an average of four years lifting experience. The men were assigned to one of two groups [8]. One group did 20-25 reps per set, while group two did 8-12 reps per set.
The findings: After 12 weeks, there was no statistically significant difference in the rate of muscle growth between the two groups.
As with the research in novices, the average size of both the fast and slow twitch muscle fibers increased to a similar extent in both groups.
But, that doesn’t mean the two protocols delivered identical results.
The average amount of muscle mass gained in the high rep group was 2.2 pounds (1 kilogram), compared with 3.5 pounds (1.6 kilograms) in the low rep group.
[h=3]High Reps vs. Low Reps: The Research[/h]Of course, these are the results from just a few studies. As I’ve explained here, drawing conclusions about anything from two or three studies is never a good idea.
However, there’s plenty of other research out there showing multiple benefits of training with a light weight and high reps.
– Light slow-speed training (55-60% of one-rep-max, 3 seconds to lift and lower the weight) has been shown to increase both muscle mass and maximal strength [3]. The results are comparable to those obtained with heavy normal-speed training (80-90% of one-rep-max, 1 second to lift and lower the weight).
– Both heavy (4 sets of 8-10 reps) and light training (4 sets of 18-20 reps) activate the expression of various genes involved in muscle growth [4].
– Eight weeks of training the arms with light weights (20 rep-max) and short (30 seconds) rest periods led to gains in muscle size that were no different to those seen with heavier weights (8 rep-max) and longer (3 minute) rest periods [1].
– Training with lighter weights and higher reps (not to failure) also stimulates protein synthesis in connective tissue just as well as heavy training, giving it a role during injury rehabilitation to improve regeneration of connective tissue [7].
– Eight weeks of training with high reps and light weights (30-40 reps per set) builds just as much muscle as low reps (8-12 reps per set) and heavy weights [10].
[h=3]Super High Rep Training: How Light is Too Light?[/h]Most of the studies we’ve looked at show similar rates of muscle growth with both low and high reps.per set?
That was the question asked by a Brazilian research team, who took a group of 30 untrained men and got them to lift weights twice a week for 12 weeks [9].
The lifters were split into three groups. All three groups trained the biceps and quads on one side of their body with very light weights and super-high reps – 20% of their one-rep max and 60-70 reps per set.
On the other side of their body, the men used one of three different loading protocols: a high-rep protocol, where the men lifted at 40% of their one-rep max for around 30 reps per set, a moderate-rep protocol, where the men lifted at 60% of their one-rep max for 15-20 reps per set, and a low-rep protocol, where the men lifted at 80% of their maximum for 10-15 reps per set.
All three groups trained to failure, and did two exercises: the biceps curl and leg press.
At the end of 12 weeks, training with low, moderate and high reps all led to similar gains in muscle size. Higher reps and lighter weights triggered just as much muscle growth as heavier weights and lower reps.
However, it was a different story for the side of the body that was trained with super-high reps, where muscles grew at half the rate they did in the other three protocols.
In other words, while sets of 30 reps led to gains in size that were on par with sets in the 10-15 rep range, training with just 20% of your one-rep max appears to be below the threshold needed to maximize gains in muscle size.
[h=3]High Reps vs. Low Reps: Two Types of Muscle Growth[/h]Some say that the type of muscle growth caused by training with lighter weights and higher reps isn’t as “good” as the muscle gained with heavier weights.
 
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bro.... if you do the same exercises in a different order... then try the same weights... at the same reps....

tell me if you're sore then.. lol

if you have.. then tells us more about your routine and maybe you'll get more help...
 
gotta switch it up. For years I did HEAVY shrugs 6-10 reps. Traps were nothing to
brag about but I would get sore as hell. This beast at the gym had a bunch of old
programs printed out so I started some of his workouts just for a change. All his
trap workouts were 20 to 25 reps. I started those but I kept the weight as heavy
as I could. I thought I was going to cry those first few workouts as those high
reps BURNED!!! My traps started to grow. I now always do heavy/high reps for traps
and people comment on them. Dont know if it was cus of the muscle type or the years
of low reps but switching it up did something. Mabey try 10 reps VERY STRICT to
failure. If what you are doing is not getting results you gotta try something different.
Any other ideas for his arms guys????
 
Thats whta I was thinking, because of my belief that the sorer I get , the better. Is that right that if Im not getting sore, Im not building muscle?
 
not really.... you're maintaining or building slowly.... if you're muscles aren't 'surprised' then you won't grow...
 
I agree. My traps need high reps and when I do high reps for arms for extended
time they seem to loose size. That is just ME!! Try the high reps for a while and
see what happens. The hardest part (in my opinion) is finding out what works for
YOU!!.. Let us know how the high reps work.
 
I never liked high reps. I can see their purpose on smaller muscles like bi's, calves, forearms, etc. But if I do high reps (15-20reps) for legs or chest or back, I usually get out of breath before I hit true failure.

lots of people use TOO heavy weight for arms though. Almost any arm exercise you do, you will use other muscles to move the weight if you use too much weight. Heavy curls will use your shoulders and back (heck, some guys dont even work out their biceps when doing curls. The entire arm/shoulder move, not the bicep). You will use your chest or shoulders during heavy tricep exercises as well.
 
dreww said:
I never liked high reps. I can see their purpose on smaller muscles like bi's, calves, forearms, etc. But if I do high reps (15-20reps) for legs or chest or back, I usually get out of breath before I hit true failure.

lots of people use TOO heavy weight for arms though. Almost any arm exercise you do, you will use other muscles to move the weight if you use too much weight. Heavy curls will use your shoulders and back (heck, some guys dont even work out their biceps when doing curls. The entire arm/shoulder move, not the bicep). You will use your chest or shoulders during heavy tricep exercises as well.
Im with you on the core excercises need to be low reps. I don't have a problem getting sore from low reps on these (squat , bench, military, deads), and to try 25 reps of one of those would burn me out real fast. Maybe Im using too much weight on bi's. I'll try less weiht with more reps. Well heading to the gym -later.
 
dreww said:
I never liked high reps. I can see their purpose on smaller muscles like bi's, calves, forearms, etc. But if I do high reps (15-20reps) for legs or chest or back, I usually get out of breath before I hit true failure.

lots of people use TOO heavy weight for arms though. Almost any arm exercise you do, you will use other muscles to move the weight if you use too much weight. Heavy curls will use your shoulders and back (heck, some guys dont even work out their biceps when doing curls. The entire arm/shoulder move, not the bicep). You will use your chest or shoulders during heavy tricep exercises as well.


This has always been my mode of operation...I have tried every type of workout known to man and high rep workout never made me bigger. Only high weight low to moderate rep workouts have worked for me. Now my reaction may just be for me, but I know of many other that have had the same reaction to high weight lower rep workout schemes. The only time I go higher than 10-12 reps is when working smaller muscles like bi's, tri's, and calfs.
 
dreww said:
I never liked high reps. I can see their purpose on smaller muscles like bi's, calves, forearms, etc. But if I do high reps (15-20reps) for legs or chest or back, I usually get out of breath before I hit true failure.

lots of people use TOO heavy weight for arms though. Almost any arm exercise you do, you will use other muscles to move the weight if you use too much weight. Heavy curls will use your shoulders and back (heck, some guys dont even work out their biceps when doing curls. The entire arm/shoulder move, not the bicep). You will use your chest or shoulders during heavy tricep exercises as well.
I used to ask the guys doing the big barbell swing - the curl when the bi
dosent even get used - what is that exercise for, lower back???
 
mcgaret said:
I used to ask the guys doing the big barbell swing - the curl when the bi
dosent even get used - what is that exercise for, lower back???
AND they are doing it in the only fucking squat rack in the gym :rolleyes:

I should take my "little man" curl bar and smack him in the face with it. Sorry bro, this rack is taken by a real bodybuilder now.
 
I change everyonce in awhile......When I stop seeing gains or my body is takinga beating I go to high reps for 2-3 weeks by that time Im ready for heavy again and gains come with it.

I guess it's about keeping your body off balance so it doesnt adapt to a certain excercise or weight load.
 
So do you guys use the sorenes factor to guage whether or not your tearing down/building muscle? Presser, do you still get sore the day after a good wokout? Remember after the first time you blasted legs, how you could hardly walk up stairs the next day? I can't get that sore anymore, and to me it feels like I'm not shocking the muscles adequately. I wonder if Ronnie Coleman still gets sore?
 
Soreness isnt a very good gauge.......lactic acid builds up makes you burn. I take actic acid buffers from champion nutrition......ts made for runners but it proved to me tha soreness doesntmean squat. The true indicator or gauge is documeneted daily, weekly logs of your improvement in the areas you wish to improve.

If you benched 200 for 10 reps last week and this week you did 12 reps or did 10 reps with 210........thats the only indicater for me. I always keep my log book.

Progress is the indicater not soreness. Mature muscle doesnt get the soreness of a newbie because it's adapted to harsh and strenuous conditions over long periods of time. I been in 16 years now and I sometimes feel very little soreness if any at all.

But people vary and opinions may vary as well.
 
gear makes a big diffrence in soreness too. When your on gear, and have trained for many years, its hard to get sore. But when your off, doing the same lifts, its going to hurt.

That doesnt mean the body isnt repairing itself when your off, obviously. So, therefore, soreness isnt an indicator. Fatigue is, when your on gear, muscles have more endurance.
 
Good Answer Cyphon. That makes alot of sense. Normal, your answer doesnt apply to me due to my difficulty of getting gear through customs. I wish it did apply, and I am working feverishly on making it happen.
 
body2see said:
I think it depends on body type and you have to find what works for you, what won't work for others. For me, I personally grow from high weight low reps, though my traps and bi's wont grow until I do high reps...

I agree with that. Different people have different makeups of the two types of muscle fibers. For example, I have to use heavy weight with the traps which makes them grow like crazy.
 
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