big in vegas
MuscleChemistry Registered Member
Anyone used just plain caffeine or caffeine pills before working out? I just started taking 1500mg before I work out and I stay amped the whole time
Caffeine???
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NAIR
MuscleChemistry Registered Member
1500 WTF? I have some pills in my cabinet that are dosed at 200...I can't even handle a half of one of those...you drink a couple pots of coffee a day?
I think you bring up an interesting question. I don't do well on caffeine, I get nervous, shaky, and anxious. I've also heard a couple trainers speak quite avidly against caffiene and other (legal) stimulant use. Like the ones in SuperPump, No-Explode etc. Principal among these trainers is Hany Rambod (I love this guy, I'm always reading his stuff). To make a long story short, he says they're vasoconstrictive and prevent blood from flowing throughout the body in a manner that is most concussive for muscle growth. Same goes for nutrients as well. If that's not bad enough, he believes that the extra strain on the heart and the elevated blood pressure is too damaging to warrant regular use.
I think you bring up an interesting question. I don't do well on caffeine, I get nervous, shaky, and anxious. I've also heard a couple trainers speak quite avidly against caffiene and other (legal) stimulant use. Like the ones in SuperPump, No-Explode etc. Principal among these trainers is Hany Rambod (I love this guy, I'm always reading his stuff). To make a long story short, he says they're vasoconstrictive and prevent blood from flowing throughout the body in a manner that is most concussive for muscle growth. Same goes for nutrients as well. If that's not bad enough, he believes that the extra strain on the heart and the elevated blood pressure is too damaging to warrant regular use.
lol any of the people on this site are all prolly poopin 5 times a day as is with the amount of food intake
NAIR
MuscleChemistry Registered Member
No Xplode and all those products do in fact contain vasodialators (always arginine) but they also contain "heavy" stimulants as well. So you the idea is you have two agents working against each other at the potential expense of the heart.
You want a good NO agent? Viagra @ 100mgs pre-workout. Incredible! No BS!
You want a good NO agent? Viagra @ 100mgs pre-workout. Incredible! No BS!
the most caffiene i have ever taken at once was 800mgs (4 x 200mg tabs) and that shit had me wired with 50mg ephedrine hcl and 150mg asparin, so im assuming u mean 150mg caffiene which is cool, and if u are realy taking 1,500mg caffiene preworkout please take a video next time for all of us to see,lol,
big in vegas
MuscleChemistry Registered Member
I have 200 mg tablets, somehow I meant to hit the "4" and managed to hit the "1" and "5" together instead lol...I have been taking 400mg pre workout. I drink a lot of energy drinks throughout the day, probably at least 1 a day and at least 24oz of coffee a day as well. Obviously, some days I'll drink more and some days less, but that's an average. My work schedule is screwed up so I needed to start getting a pick me up before training and so far this is working
Oh shit I remember when that was the stack, I always just did the ephedrine and asprin, than after I worked out my skin would be tingling like when u get out of a tanning bed and step into the sun.... I was 19 back than tho dont think id do it now a days
Oh its one of those deals where it has constrictors and dialators all in one? yeah thats not cool, I use super NOS now, dif brand, only has dialators, and I only take 1 per day 30-45 mins pre workout, they recommend 4. They are horse pills tho. Kind of funny that the orals that do the least amount are huge, and some real badass shit that will turn u into a monster are trifling in comparison, anyone ever notice that? If I did viagra b4 the gym there would be massive amounts of problems lol
NAIR
MuscleChemistry Registered Member
Yea, and I noticed I may have made an incorrect assumption with the way I worded my post. Most of these products do contain precisely what I stated however I'm not so sure they are necessarily working against each other. I'd bet mike ross would most likely be able to better explain their their action in the body when taken together.
It seems likely to me that since arginine works to increase NO and and lend to vasodilation, and stimulants of any kind lead to vasoconstriction, you'd essentially be contradicting yourself. I'd imagine that the idea is to produce max vasodilation, and go lighter on the stimulants -- I suppose that way your getting a little bit of both. Still I find myself convinced with Rambod's argument that stimulants should be avoided regularly.
And Viagra shows up about every other issue of MD. It really is an exceptional NO supplement and despite my outrageous sex drive, I've never become aroused during a workout while using it. You have to consider the frame of mind your in when training...given the intensity and focus on the training, at least for me, sex is the last thing in my mind. Then again, I now train in an enviorment where women are far and few between...
It seems likely to me that since arginine works to increase NO and and lend to vasodilation, and stimulants of any kind lead to vasoconstriction, you'd essentially be contradicting yourself. I'd imagine that the idea is to produce max vasodilation, and go lighter on the stimulants -- I suppose that way your getting a little bit of both. Still I find myself convinced with Rambod's argument that stimulants should be avoided regularly.
And Viagra shows up about every other issue of MD. It really is an exceptional NO supplement and despite my outrageous sex drive, I've never become aroused during a workout while using it. You have to consider the frame of mind your in when training...given the intensity and focus on the training, at least for me, sex is the last thing in my mind. Then again, I now train in an enviorment where women are far and few between...
yea
anything thing that is contradicting each other at the same time is not good for you.. ie red bull and vodka, like dont snort some coc and workout, just bad. I feel there are may suppliments out there with worse repercussions than aas
NAIR
MuscleChemistry Registered Member
Agreed.
I found a Q&A on Muscular Development featuring Hany. I wear on on a stack of bibles I didn't read this prior to posting lol (it says quite nearly what I did).
The Pro Creator-Hany Rambod
Why are there no carbs or stimulants in your Evo P 1 Alpha product? Most of the other products of this type seem to have both and yours doesn’t.
The reason I stayed away from carbs in the product is that I would like athletes to have the option to add in carbs if need be. If it’s off-season and you feel you need them before or after workouts, carbs are cheap and easy to get. But if you’re dieting and trying to lean out, whether for a photo shoot or contest, you can’t use products with carbs. They will severely blunt the fat-burning effects you are aiming for, especially if you are following a very low-carb diet program.
Many companies use carbs as fillers, simply because they cost so little. There is no caffeine in the product, either. Caffeine certainly has its place for fat-burning and cardio. But once you put it into a product designed to enhance your pump, you are making a big mistake. Caffeine constricts the blood vessels and restricts blood flow— it’s a ‘vasoconstrictor.’ Arginine-based NO boosters are designed to relax the blood vessels and increase blood flow— they are ‘vasodilators.’ Why would you put two substances with totally opposite effects in the same supplement?
This is why products with the best stimulant effects are usually the absolute worst at helping with pump. With my athletes, I want to maximize the fullness of the muscles; that’s facilitated by achieving the best pumps possible in training, and stretching the muscle fascia. Increased blood flow also helps with anti-catabolic factors and increases nitric oxide transport. Maximum vasodilation means that you get more of the raw materials delivered, and faster.
When using caffeine, you’re fighting and limiting all those positive effects. Hindering blood flow hurts your pump and also hurts your anabolic environment, which subsequently restricts getting the nutrients quickly into muscle tissue. So as great as it may feel to be ‘wired’ in the gym on some product loaded with caffeine, it’s not doing you any favors.
I found a Q&A on Muscular Development featuring Hany. I wear on on a stack of bibles I didn't read this prior to posting lol (it says quite nearly what I did).
The Pro Creator-Hany Rambod
Why are there no carbs or stimulants in your Evo P 1 Alpha product? Most of the other products of this type seem to have both and yours doesn’t.
The reason I stayed away from carbs in the product is that I would like athletes to have the option to add in carbs if need be. If it’s off-season and you feel you need them before or after workouts, carbs are cheap and easy to get. But if you’re dieting and trying to lean out, whether for a photo shoot or contest, you can’t use products with carbs. They will severely blunt the fat-burning effects you are aiming for, especially if you are following a very low-carb diet program.
Many companies use carbs as fillers, simply because they cost so little. There is no caffeine in the product, either. Caffeine certainly has its place for fat-burning and cardio. But once you put it into a product designed to enhance your pump, you are making a big mistake. Caffeine constricts the blood vessels and restricts blood flow— it’s a ‘vasoconstrictor.’ Arginine-based NO boosters are designed to relax the blood vessels and increase blood flow— they are ‘vasodilators.’ Why would you put two substances with totally opposite effects in the same supplement?
This is why products with the best stimulant effects are usually the absolute worst at helping with pump. With my athletes, I want to maximize the fullness of the muscles; that’s facilitated by achieving the best pumps possible in training, and stretching the muscle fascia. Increased blood flow also helps with anti-catabolic factors and increases nitric oxide transport. Maximum vasodilation means that you get more of the raw materials delivered, and faster.
When using caffeine, you’re fighting and limiting all those positive effects. Hindering blood flow hurts your pump and also hurts your anabolic environment, which subsequently restricts getting the nutrients quickly into muscle tissue. So as great as it may feel to be ‘wired’ in the gym on some product loaded with caffeine, it’s not doing you any favors.
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