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fstr03svtcobra said:

So you want to bulk and cut at the same time.

First thing is shift your training to heavier weight because that will improve metabolic needs.

Diet wise: Don't count calories and cut out all the carbs that are not within an hour before or after training. Even when I'm "bulking" which I do almost year round I do this. There's no reason for that many carbs IMO. Calories = growth. Keeping that in mind, take in as much fat and protein as you can right up until you train, then pound the carbs pre, during, and post training.
Example template:
Breakfast: 2 scoops protein, peanut butter, cottage cheese, ice, water all blended in a blender.
Meal 2: 7 eggs scrambled with cheese, turkey bacon
Meal 3 (pre training): protein, oats, turkey sandwich
During workout: gatorade
Post workout: Protein
Whole meal Post Workout: whatever carb + 8oz of meat
Pre bed: as much fat and protein to satisfy you

Supplements: cut out the powder carbs IMO, also add in an ecay stack and do starved cardio 3+ days a week.

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Great advise here bro! Once you learn how to eat most meals without carbs good things happen.


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Ok I'll try that, my plan will be this. Keep with the high protein and carbs for now while on MC igf-1..if it's over kill no big deal I can easily get back on diet with calorie defecit and no cheat meals and lose all the extra fat pounds, I'll try my first ecay stack once I'm done bulking wth the igf, and the ecay should help me quickly get shredded again... I'll try the carb around workout and maybe some with breakfast only...I prob shouldn't take adderall if taking ecay though right?

raysd21 said:

The only substances I know of that would allow you to shred fat on a bulking diet is a stack of trenbolone and winstrol. And I think you are eating too much for your weight. Did your trainer advise you on this diet? 220g protein/day seems like a lot for someone 160lbs not on gear. I would start by cutting your calorie intake by about....12%-15% across the board if you keep eating carbs like that. As far as shredding fat on a bulking diet... not on gear...:tread::tread: good luck. T3, clen, ephedrine. Cybersupplements has some good stuff but he is down.

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I agree with raysd21 review diet and your trainer

cream123 said:

I'm not quite understanding that. I'm not less than 10% body fat but I would like to be... I may do the ecay. Finish up the next 6 weeks bulking with igf-1 while my carb intake is high, then immediately after go to a calorie defecit and do the ecay and just try n knock every ounce of fat off In 3 weeks.. I'll prob be like 14% body fat when I'm down with igf unless it burns more fat than I remember time will tell... But please do explain ur comment cuZ I def wouldn't mind being sub 10% body fat year round... I won't do roids though.. Igf-1 ecay things like that, that don't mess wit ur test levels

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I'm not on 'roids' either man. Basically the only way I know how to keep sub 10% bf and keep gaining is with the high calorie, nutrient timing diet I outlined for you.

I can do that.. Let's talk about ecay.. How do I feel on that? I've tried Clen I hate the way I feel on it

cream123 said:

I can do that.. Let's talk about ecay.. How do I feel on that? I've tried Clen I hate the way I feel on it

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You'll feel fine. How about you do some research and tell me what dosages you are going to do on the ecay.

Stop worrying about adding things. Your problem is your diet. If your trainer hasn't outlined that for you then you are pissing your money away. Sorry Bro just shooting you straight.
I know how it is to be overly enthusiastic and have your mind racing for a secret. Follow this and if you are consistent and not a lean 185 - 190 in 24 months than submit yourself for testing as your physiology isn't consistent with the rest of the human race.
8 oz lean ground beef and some carbs and fats (couple cups of rice, pasta, bagel, sandwich, etc) 4 times a day. I don't know how much olive oil I go through in a week, but I probably go through a gallon a month
Have a post workout shake.
20 minutes of cardio 4 times a week before eating or after training.
After 4 weeks check your weight and B/F caliper measurements. If after 2 months you gain more than say 10mm total in the calipers, cut out 75g of carbs. No "bulking or cutting". Sleep 8+ hours and stay away from alcohol. Train each body part once a week.
That's about it man. So simple that it just might work....
The diet is hard... that's why most struggle. It's a tremendous commitment, but everything else is just stimulus. Food builds tissue and controls your metabolism. As you get bigger you will need more food. Stay away from dairy to keep bodyfat lower


The Dude Approved

^That's a lot of beef!

DefMetalLifter said:

^That's a lot of beef!

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It is Bro and it's tough, but it's a simple easy to prepare diet and I followed it for years.... so I'm not advocating anything I haven't done myself with tremendous success
I still eat 5 - 6+ lbs of lean ground beef a week. Add in all the tilapia and chicken and I eat a smidge over 2lbs of meat a day. That's not including the turkey sausage, turkey bacon, eggs....


The Dude Approved

I should clarify though that I go by the weight on the package, not cooked weight. So it may be less when cooked


The Dude Approved

I just wanted faster results, I'm done spending money on supplements. And I only been dieting for 5 months.. I just wanted faster results... Not gonna do ecay, but mc igf is great lol

I can do that.. Let's talk about ecay.. How do I feel on that? I've tried Clen I hate the way I feel on it

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Most compounds that work well are not going to be a walk in the park with your sippy cup and flinstone gummies.

:moon:

raysd21 said:

And by the way using igf specifically for fat loss is borderline misusing igf. You have to eat a proper amount of carbohydrates for it to be effective.

What do we want? Bigger muscles. More muscle cells that we will later grow with exercise and gear. A pump? Fatloss? You can get a pump with a good "pump" product. Fatloss? Clen/Alb and T3/T4 will give it to you again at a fraction of the price of IGF-1. More muscle cells, you can ONLY get with IGF-1 (and MGF too). Nothing else will give it to you and if you are using IGF-1 for anything else, you are misusing it. More muscle cells is CLEARLY the best use for IGF-1.

What does all this tell us?

It tells us that we should use IGF-1 to make more muscle cells. It's the only thing that can give it to us and more cells is more growth, which is our goal.

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And injury restoration.

This thread got really complicated for a simple thing. Do we really need to swollow or inject everything that might possibly give fat loss or some small advantage? What about the big things/ Diet, training and rest. It's sort of simple. Eat clean and you are going to have a hard time putting on fat. Keep carbs within your specific tolerance. Seeing that you are probably 16% BF or more I would say you are sensitive to carbs. limit them. Train heavy center around deadlifts, squats, bench bent rows, military presses. They will shock your body to put on mass. Eat to feed it and keep it clean means you will not get sloppy. Rest, get your 8 hrs a night and nap on week ends. All you need to grow at your stage is good nutrition, train hard and heavy, and rest. The human body was designed to adapt. give it the stimulus and nutrition and allow it time to adapt and you are moving forward. PEDs come later when you figure these general principles out. Trainers can be good or really bad. All it takes to be a trainer is a certificate.

glycomann said:

This thread got really complicated for a simple thing. Do we really need to swollow or inject everything that might possibly give fat loss or some small advantage? What about the big things/ Diet, training and rest. It's sort of simple. Eat clean and you are going to have a hard time putting on fat. Keep carbs within your specific tolerance. Seeing that you are probably 16% BF or more I would say you are sensitive to carbs. limit them. Train heavy center around deadlifts, squats, bench bent rows, military presses. They will shock your body to put on mass. Eat to feed it and keep it clean means you will not get sloppy. Rest, get your 8 hrs a night and nap on week ends. All you need to grow at your stage is good nutrition, train hard and heavy, and rest. The human body was designed to adapt. give it the stimulus and nutrition and allow it time to adapt and you are moving forward. PEDs come later when you figure these general principles out. Trainers can be good or really bad. All it takes to be a trainer is a certificate.

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Hands down THE BEST ADVICE I've heard in a long damn time!!!! :thumbsup:

It got complicated cause the op is a wackjob pantywaste who either doesn't listen or disregards the help. Then insults us for using gear and complains when his results aren't fast enough. As of now I'm officially over this thread. Wait.... not yet.... ok now.

I just wanted faster results, I'm done spending money on supplements. And I only been dieting for 5 months.. I just wanted faster results... Not gonna do ecay

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And how do you approach the pharmacy for ephedrine?

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I wanna take whatever I can to get as big and cut as possible

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I've tried Clen I hate the way I feel on it

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But I want to continue on the bulking diet and some how shred this fat

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I haven't given it much of a chance yet but I wanna stack some other things (non natural stuff) but I don't wanna mess with my test levels so cycling is out of the picture.

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What u guys think about riptropin?

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I won't do roids though

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raysd21 said:

It got complicated cause the op is a wackjob pantywaste who either doesn't listen or disregards the help. Then insults us for using gear and complains when his results aren't fast enough. As of now I'm officially over this thread. Wait.... not yet.... ok now.

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Wow.. schizophrenia?