Test Prop Tren Ace NPP Dbol Cycle Need HELP after TRT disappointment

Hello
Been roughly 4 mounths since i was on a self prescribed TRT dose of 200mgs. Cyp.
Went to Endo and was refused TRT treatment from both Endos I tried.
Anywas current stats:
5'10" 186 bodyfat 15-18
Even while trying to eat well i put on a good 10lbs. of pure nasty fat! Lol
Been off all test for 4 months now. Failed to pct bcuz i thought i had TRT in the bag at 43yrs old and sub par test levels.
Cycle layout?
2 prop 100
3 cyp 250
2 tren ace 100
2 NPP 150
Dbol 20mg 100 tabs
Letrozole and arimidex on hand
8 wk. Cycle planned.

M/W/F
Prop 100
Tren 100
Npp 150
Dbol 20mg tabs x100

Going to run Dbol 1-6 @ 60mgs
M/W/F
Npp 150
Tren 100
Prop 100
Cyp 500 wk
Letro.5 every 3rd day or modify as needed.
Does this cycle seem adequate or should i up my tren?
I don't want to cycle past 7-8wks. Since Myostatin stalls me everytime. Then cont. w my cruise dose of 250mgs.Cyp.
I've run much higher doses of all above anabolics many times before but never off everything including my cruise dose. Hoping from the long rest my body will be much more responsive then my usual B&C cycles b4.
Cycle goals are a lean bulk. Eating roughly 4000+ cals i still need to fine tune my diet accordingly but this is my 6th cycle. Lost at least 15lbs. muscle and added 3-4% vodyfat since off all gear.
Lmk your opinions kind preferably but honesty imperative. And for those that don't blast and cruise plz don't bother flamming.
Thx fellow brothers

What reason did they refuse?

No offense. Your layout is a little odd bro... Tell me if I have this correct.
Also, have you ran all of these compounds before?

"Going to run Dbol 1-6 @ 60mgs

("BF @ 15-18%", "gained 10lbs of FAT while TRYING to eat clean". Dude. You should absolutely drop this COMPLETELY & replace it with IGF-1LR3 from Advanced Supplements!) That is, if you're trying to look better... I guess "Lean Bulk" is similar to "Recomp"? If so, drop the Dbol brother. You have PLENTY going on here... Still too much in my opinion...
I understand it's the norm to run an oral and that's cool, but why not Tbol or something that doesn't convert so much?
Dbol just doesn't seem right for you, but I don't know what your experience is with it.
It's just really wet and the gains are dirty (very hard to maintain) for most if E2 isn't managed...


M/W/F

Npp 150 (I'm guessing you're gonna take 150mg on each day? M/W/F) If so, that's a reasonable dose for experienced users. Are you?
Tren 100 ( " " ) 100mg/EOD is most common for experienced users. Again. Are you?
Prop 100 ( " " ) Personally, I would just take this and drop the CYP completely. 300mg/Week should be plenty as a base for the NPP & TREN

Cyp 500 wk This makes sense, although personally I don't believe so much Test is needed with all this other stuff in the mix. To each his own though. If you've "ran a lot of cycles" you should know what works for you. Just seems a little much considering it looks like you're also running 300mg/Week Test Prop, if I'm reading it correctly?...
Do you really need 800mg/Week of Test in your current physical condition?

Letro.5 every 3rd day or modify as needed." LETRO? Shouldn't that be the VERY LAST thing you would take only for an emergency flare up or noticeable rise in Estro?..
Do you not have Aromasin or Arimidex for "on cycle"?
What about Nolva & Clomid? Do you not want those on hand "just in case"? I understand you're gonna cruise, but it just doesn't look safe brother.

Honestly, I've had more gear than I know what to do with (well.. u get what I'm sayin) for like 4 months now, but I've missed my window for the winter cycle I had planned, because I haven't been able to get my hands on the ancillaries I need.
Talk about FRUSTRATING!!!!?!?? VERY MUCH SO!!!

All I'm saying is, I want to be doing this for as long as possible in the safest way possible. Ancillaries are kind of a big deal to me, but to each his own.
You just don't seem to be prepared if LETRO is all you have, but you say you have 6 cycles under your belt, so maybe you don't have to manage your hormones?...
You've also kind of made it sound like you haven't achieved very much over those 6 cycles though, right?
I'm not offended, nor do I mean to offend brother.
I'm only concerned for your safety. That's all, but you're a grown man. We make our own decisions.
Blasting & cruising is fine if it works for you, but are you keeping ANY of your results brother?
It just reads like something isn't right, and I have a pretty good idea what it is. Just sayin'...

BTW, Do you not worry about Prolactin?..
You're running TWO VERY POTENT 19-Nor compounds together. Have you done this before?
Did you just forget to mention Caber(Dostinex), or do you really not run it?

I don't mean to come across harsh bro.
Just telling you what I see, but obviously, I don't have all of the required information to fully help either
I do hope I was able to help a little though.

Either way, I'm interested to see how things go for you.
Keep us posted brother and good luck!

Nixon made good points on everything.
Run prop at 150 every other day.
Better yet I would do this.
Test cypionate 500-750 wk dosed half split on two days. Wk 1-8
I would do dbol at 20-30 1-4week for boost and I can get lean on this dose I don't aromatase till over 30mg.
Tren a 75 EOD week 8-13
Test prop 75-100 EOD week 8-13
Letro .3 twice week from start then .5 twice week around week 2. Up letro as needed careful.
Switching to short esters will help control estro in final weeks and tren prop will give u a recomp and tren will aid in plateau point after week 8.
Your pct or cruise
PCT Nolva and clomid standard protocol.
Letro dose tapered according to prop and tren aromatasing. Should be off or on low dose letro first week of pct. If cruising letro stay on maintainance dose twice week. I do above all the time works for me.

- - - Updated - - -

Don't use NPP this round. Run tren separate than NPP those two should be kept in separate cycles!!!

After this cycle and pct then have your Dr found who does trt and go try then. I would search for dr in your area who do trt as part of internal medicine practice. Personally I would cruise at 100-150 week at most. This is enough to maintain most muscle if pushing in workout and diet with proper rest. I would throw a sarm in like osta or log with igf with lower cruise. The whole point is to let body rest at normal levels. Doing this cools down our systems and allows for better response after approximately 8 weeks is taken

Presser said:

What reason did they refuse?

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Bump for a response to this question. Why did they refuse? Did you tell them you had been on testosterone? Try going to either an internal medicine doc like Muscle mechanic said or a urologist. They are more willing to prescribe for TRT/HRT.

Presser said:

What reason did they refuse?

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My test levels were just a tab over 600ng.
I stopped running test 400 for over two months and it still was to high. And i was really only running.5cc's one weekly. Crazy huh?

Muscle Mechanic i don't understand how tje cycle got pushed to 13wks. Gains stall after 60 days time amd time again for me regardless of bumping calories sky high! Amd no memtion of NPP. I figure I could run the tren wks 3-10 to extend my cycle but i just don't know if Myostatin will prevent me from furthuring gains past this point. I have Clomid Letrozole 20 Arimidex and 50 40mg Nolvadex on hand for AI protection.
All jelp is greatly appreciated. Plz keep me posted.
Tjx again.

Nikon thanks for the detailed insight and time you put into helping me get my cycle correct. I have run NPP and Tren together knowing that they are both 19nors amd never had any unwanted symptoms.
I have clomid 50mg tabs and Nolva 40mg tabs as well as a few Arimidex not enough if i was to rely on this as my Primary AI.
Im an ectomorph and worked out naturally for 7yrs. eating upwards of 3500 calories daily even on off days. I went from 155 to roughly 180 and slammed a brick wall. Once i started to cycle i went as high as 209 w 11% bodyfat according to 3 point calipers. I have pictures of my body from last year until now. And since jumping off my Trt dosage hoping i would be able to get help thru my endo i lost over 15lbs lean mass while gaining another 10-15lbs. in fat.
My objectives this cycle is to grab back a lean 10-12lbs. while shedding the recently gained handles.
Also the reason behind using Dbol other than the extreme strength gains and sense of well being is it works much better than Tbol unless i run 2x the dosage for twice the period of time. Once the Dbol runs its course the water weight dissolves anyways. As long as letro or Nolva is used throughout. I wanted to run prop mwf until the cyp kicked in. Im going to continue to run the cyp@200 after my cycle not only to solidify my gains but for my TRT dosage.
Do you see another more effective way of running the cycle i have w the products i have on hand? I have access to tren ace and Npp 150 readily avaible if i decide to extend the cycle a couple more weeks. If Myostatin stalls me after 60 days or so i could always use this opportunity to cut up since adding lean mass is useless till Myostatin base lines 20wks. later
Thanks again and look forward to your input.

BTW i just weighed myself and im sitting at exactly 200lbs. My scale is way off from my Primary care dr.
Don't know if this helps any. Just want to keep everything out front.

Scottyhash77 said:

Muscle Mechanic i don't understand how tje cycle got pushed to 13wks. Gains stall after 60 days time amd time again for me regardless of bumping calories sky high! Amd no memtion of NPP. I figure I could run the tren wks 3-10 to extend my cycle but i just don't know if Myostatin will prevent me from furthuring gains past this point. I have Clomid Letrozole 20 Arimidex and 50 40mg Nolvadex on hand for AI protection.
All jelp is greatly appreciated. Plz keep me posted.
Tjx again.

Click to expand...

U said u trying to lose body fat. Staying on higher androgens longer still have alot to do with losing fat. I agree that gains come to a halt around 8 to 10 weeks but not completely. And finishing with tren does alot I'm regards to myo or whatever is the culprit. Also finishing into a recomp going from having some mass to getting hard with less fat preserving muscle. There is no set rule on gains stopping. Alot of it has to do with changing up.
I mention npp, I told u to use at another time. Just as Nixon said, u mentioned u trying to lose fat.
All those things are not needed to lose fat during a cycle. U asking for sides from all directions with all that together
If u trying to lose fat, when the time gains halt that is when u don't put your calories sky high, that is when the fat burning magic comes into play while the gear is preserving muscle. That is right. Gains may halt but I never lost muscle during that time but lost fat

Not to mention u said u were running test 400 5cc a week for 2 months and didn't pct. If u did this why so worried about being so religious to an 60 days gains halt.
Alot of guys stay on for 12 to 20 weeks and makeep progress. The 60 day deal is something that slows down but often ignored because of fat burning and strength bennifits.

Just saying!!! I also said if it were me and worked with some of what u had. The advice I mentioned is what I would do with with u have and not use the npp.
The 13 weeks was to get most out of your gear while gaining and leaning. I only short burst blast for mass gains not for recomp and leaning up

Sorry Scotty, lol thought u said 5 cc a week but noticed it was 0.5 meaning 1/2 cc. My bad brother.

Would like to modify my post to Bulk then Cut after Myostain causes my gains to stall

Presser said:

What reason did they refuse?

Click to expand...

Hello Presser
Beem thinking of extending my cycle past 7 weeks and cutting after my initial Lean Bulk.
Possibly running the 3 bottles of Cyp at 750 and leaning out a bit since i can no longer keep growing.
What do you think and how would you go about doing it?
Thx again

Scottyhash77 said:

My test levels were just a tab over 600ng.
I stopped running test 400 for over two months and it still was to high. And i was really only running.5cc's one weekly. Crazy huh?

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Well no wonder they refused. 600 is right in the middle of the range. You usually have to be 350 or lower to even be considered for TRT. If your test 400 contained some long esters, that would be why it was still coming up high. Look at the separate components of the test 400, what half lives do they have? You'd need to let it all come down to test low enough to be put on TRT. But if you're going to be on a cycle, it won't matter for you to even try to be on TRT.

Scottyhash77 said:

Hello Presser
Beem thinking of extending my cycle past 7 weeks and cutting after my initial Lean Bulk.
Possibly running the 3 bottles of Cyp at 750 and leaning out a bit since i can no longer keep growing.
What do you think and how would you go about doing it?
Thx again

Click to expand...

I know 7 weeks wouldnt cut it for me, and bro, How come you registered a New Username here? You had another or maybe even a couple different "scottyhash" usernames here, so curious why the new username,

Scottyhash77 said:

Nikon thanks for the detailed insight and time you put into helping me get my cycle correct. I have run NPP and Tren together knowing that they are both 19nors amd never had any unwanted symptoms.
I have clomid 50mg tabs and Nolva 40mg tabs as well as a few Arimidex not enough if i was to rely on this as my Primary AI.
Im an ectomorph and worked out naturally for 7yrs. eating upwards of 3500 calories daily even on off days. I went from 155 to roughly 180 and slammed a brick wall. Once i started to cycle i went as high as 209 w 11% bodyfat according to 3 point calipers. I have pictures of my body from last year until now. And since jumping off my Trt dosage hoping i would be able to get help thru my endo i lost over 15lbs lean mass while gaining another 10-15lbs. in fat.
My objectives this cycle is to grab back a lean 10-12lbs. while shedding the recently gained handles.
Also the reason behind using Dbol other than the extreme strength gains and sense of well being is it works much better than Tbol unless i run 2x the dosage for twice the period of time. Once the Dbol runs its course the water weight dissolves anyways. As long as letro or Nolva is used throughout. I wanted to run prop mwf until the cyp kicked in. Im going to continue to run the cyp@200 after my cycle not only to solidify my gains but for my TRT dosage.
Do you see another more effective way of running the cycle i have w the products i have on hand? I have access to tren ace and Npp 150 readily avaible if i decide to extend the cycle a couple more weeks. If Myostatin stalls me after 60 days or so i could always use this opportunity to cut up since adding lean mass is useless till Myostatin base lines 20wks. later
Thanks again and look forward to your input.

Click to expand...

Thanks for clearing things up a bit Scotty.

Honestly, You know your body better than I do brother.
Sounds like you've ran everything you're running for this cycle before, so you know best.

You sound a lot like me, although the most I've ever made it up to is 190 (I'm 5'9), but I manage to eat clean enough to keep my bf% to a minimum.
I'm currently back down to 165-170 from 180 because I've been off for so long since I can't get my hands on any ancillaries (I have a small amount of gyno on right side that flares up when "on"), but hopefully I'll have what I need soon.
My shirts are just as tight as they were at 180 though, so I guess I'm doing okay.
I have a tough time getting ripped, because I HATE cardio, but it is what it is.
I have practically zero fat anywhere except for my chest and torso. Haven't been able to get rid of it for 20 years. It sucks!
I'm really hoping to get back to at least 180 for spring, but we'll see what happens.

Anyway, it just seems like you could gain the 10-12lbs muscle back in 8 weeks EASY due to muscle memory, right?...
It just sounds crazy to me that you need that much test and dbol though. I know a lot of guys run those doses, but I don't get it. I still say drop the CYP at least.
I realize you''ll shed the water from the dbol (6 weeks though?..), but it will take a lot longer to shed it from the CYP bro.
From what I've read, matching your test dose with your Deca/NPP dose seems to be the norm, right?
It's just a lot of stuff to be running, but like I said, if you've ran all of this before, it seems like you should already have the answers...

As far as losing what you've gained, just work your tail off and eat clean bro.
The Tren will do the rest. Especially at the dose you're taking.
It sounds like an 8 week recomp to me?...
I don't really get the whole bulking then cutting in one cycle thing.
It makes more sense to me to just eat as clean as possible all the time anyway. Just sayin'.

Just plan your diet for a clean recomp brother!
Eat clean and get 1.5-2gm protein per pound of body weight EVERY DAY. Good fats. Good carbs. Veggies. Simple...
I see no reason why you can't achieve your goals this way brother!

I still say replace the dbol with IGF-1LR3 from Advanced Supps. Have you ever taken it before?

Presser said:

I know 7 weeks wouldnt cut it for me, and bro, How come you registered a New Username here? You had another or maybe even a couple different "scottyhash" usernames here, so curious why the new username,

Click to expand...

Hey Pressor your tight i did but ehen i got another phone i wasn't able to retrive my gmail account padsword so it forced me to start all over again. Hope this didn't cause any pronlems. Maybe if possible you could metge all my posts togther in one profile. That would be much appreciated.
Thx again Pressor