back and bi's not richeous.

Glen Whitestone

New member
I talk to a lot of folks who like to do back and bi's and chest and tri's in the same day. I do not like the results. For a time saver it can work for a week but I don't like to repeat it. I feel when I get to bi's after doing back I am work down from the secondary strain in them already. I do my work and I do not get sore. I prefer to break them up. Rather do back and tri's and chest and bi's a few days apart. I feel I have full strenth and potential to each muscle group. Gives me good results. If I am sore two days later I know I have done my job!
 
Well, one of my biggest prbelms with a routein where you work everything like that one day is the fact that you are spent before the end and you sacrifice your workout b/c you could have pushed yourself more had you broken it up moreso.
 
i get too tired after a chest or shoulder workout to do my tri's the poor fellows are already dead and anything im able to do witht hem at that point is sad. i tend to separate like u said u were doing, i feel i get better results, plus it keeps me in the gym getting something done on different days
 
I'm not in good enough shape to work out anymore than two major muscle groups in one day. there is no way I would be able to get that much work done. I may look like I'm in great shape (6'3" 275lbs 9.2% BF) but I would fall down dead if I speant anymore than an hour working out.
 
You call that 'not in good enough shape???' You're in perfect shape Tom--I'd take that shape in a heartbeat over mine. You are only supposed to work about an hour anyway or it becomes detrimental to your development because cortisol and other catabolic hormones really skyrocket after an hour.
 
Lol!

I'm not talking about physical "shape" I'm more talking about how I can't walk from the parking lot to my desk without getting out of breath and sweating like a cracker at a panther rally.
 
Hmmm....maybe it's time for more cardio, eh? Lol! I'm probably not that much better off when it comes to that, but then I'm also 10 years older than you--I'm entitled! j/k!
 
I'll be splitting my workouts up something like this starting next week:

Monday: Chest, Shoulders, Abs - 30 Min Cardio

Tuesday: 45 Min Cardio

Wednesday: Back - 30 Min Cardio

Thursday: 45 Min Cardio

Friday: Biceps, Triceps, Abs

Saturday: Light Legs, 1 Hour Cardio

Sunday: Rest
 
I hate training bi's and back together, same goes for chest and triceps. I think you'd be sacrificing a good arm workout. I train biceps with chest and triceps with shoulders and traps.
 
Well, the one thing to rememebr is when you train like that you are working your tri's on chest day as a secondary muscle and then again as a primary mover on tri day. Your body needs time to rest and recoop and so you have to make sure you dont overtrain using a program like that.
 
Their is no such thing as over training only UNDER EATING, LOL j/k. Ya i keep my workouts brief, i just find that split works best for me.
 
Glen, actually if your sore 2 days after your workout, you are not doing your job. Thats actually your body destroying your muscle cells due to lipid peroxidation which is the process of free radicals attacking your healhty muscle cells and turning them rancid. DEF NOT a good thing. Its commonly referred to as DOMS but its NOT good and not necessary for growth. I would up your amino acids, antioxidants, Vit C, and Vit E if your having noticing that.
 
da_Fonz said:
Glen, actually if your sore 2 days after your workout, you are not doing your job. Thats actually your body destroying your muscle cells due to lipid peroxidation which is the process of free radicals attacking your healhty muscle cells and turning them rancid. DEF NOT a good thing. Its commonly referred to as DOMS but its NOT good and not necessary for growth. I would up your amino acids, antioxidants, Vit C, and Vit E if your having noticing that.

So how does this apply to new trainees or people resuming training from a long lay off? As people tend to be sore from one workout for almost an entire week before they hit it again. Granted, with longer training consistency, I would worry if by doing the same routine all of a sudden I was sore for 4 days days as opposed to the usual one, except on circumstance where I would have switched up my routine or added a shocker drop set or the like.

I've heard of DOMS, but wasn't quite familiar about it, and i'm sure i'd be hearing about it when my exercise physiology class starts up in the next couple of weeks.
 
Well, for those ppl who are just starting out the intenstiy of the workout will dictate how "the amount of free radicals released in the body" which will dictated how sore they become but this sorness can/should be shortened dramatically by taking certain precautions. I wrote a thread in here and I'll have to look it up so get the full picture of whatz goin on inside when ppl are sore for days a time after lifting.
 
Here is the first part of the thread, hope this helps ya:

Muscle power is generated by conversion of the chemical energy of a compound in your muscle cells called ATP. But your store of ATP is very limited. During exercise it must be rengerated continuously. The principle way your body does this is by conversion of muscle stores of fat and sugar (glycogen).

We need to dip into a bit of biochem to understand how this happens, but dont worry I will keep it simple. Understanding this will help realize why some supps work and others are mearly hype.

The conversion of fat to sugar to energy occur by oxidation. Pairs of hydrogen atoms (H2) fire off from fat and sugar like guided missles, and hit oxygen (O) to form water. For 95% of your bodily consumption, the conversion is pretty clean and does not produce many free radicals.

Though it involves only 5% of your oxygen to use, this pathway is very dirty. That is every time you exercise, it produces million of superoxide free radicals which act like sharp razors, damaging every muscle they contact. The damage they cause is the MAJOR source of continued muscle soreness and weakness you feel days after heavy exercise.

There are over 100 studies that supprt this discovery. I will touch on a fraction of them but if you feel the need ot review them all then read, Oxy-radicals in Molecular Biology and Pathology.

Whenever you push in training, the secario gets worse. Athletes in top gear use 12 to 20 times more oxygen than sedentary folk. Thats a ton of free radical potential.

The sheer volume of oxygen is not the only reason that exercise overwhelms your muscles with free radicals. The vital chemical cytpchrome C also gets used up. Cytochrome C is the catalyst in the chain reaction that regenrates ATP, so your muscles can continue working. With an intensity of exercise beyond wimp level, cytochrome C activity can drop by 50% or more.

When cytochrome C activity falls, another nutrient yourve heard about, coenzyme Q, comes to the rescue. But in regenerating ATP, CoQ itself may produce some free radicals. Despite the oxidation of CoQ itself, you need high muscle levels if you want to excel.

The free radicals attack caused by exercise doesnt stop when you stop exercising. The radicals continue to injure you long afterwards. Free radicals react with your fats inside your muscle cell membranes and make them go rancid, a process called lipid perioxidation.

The rancid cells themselves become free radicals, which in turn do more damage and spwan even more free radicals. With every bout of exercise, you literally get an inflammatory chain reaction that lasts up to 20 hours.

The combined muslce damage caused by free radicals produced during exercise, plus the hydyroxy chain reaction after exercise, is not the end of the story. The damage itself iniiates another free radical sequence that goes on for days.

It happens this way. As with any bodily injury, as soon as free radical damage occurs your immune system becomes active to combat it. The ground troops called neutrophils, move in to mop up the dead and decaying muscle cells. But in doing so they realse more free radicals. The net effect is a free radical circus which leaves you stiff and sore for up to 5 days.

I'll write another thread about what you can do to stop the madness, lol. I apologize for the length of this post but its important to understand and dispell the misconceptions of soreness.
 
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