Q
QueenofDamned
Guest
ive had a couple of canadian members pm me concerning the laws of steroids in canada, so i thought i would post this up for you to see
The two biggest terms are
Possession: a) a person has anything in possession when he has it in his personal possessions or knowingly
i) has it in the actual possession or custody of another person, or
ii) has it in any place, whether or not that place belongs to or is occupied by him, for the use or benefit of himself or of another person; and
b) where one of two or more persons, with the knowledge and consent of the rest, has anything in his custody or possession, it shall be deemed to be in the custody and possession of each and all of them
Traffic: means in respect of a substance included in any of Schedules I to IV
a) to sell, administer, give, transfer, transport, send or deliver the substance, or
b) to sell an authorization to obtain the substance, or
c) to offer to do anything mentioned in paragraph a) or b)
otherwise than under the authority (doctor, pharmacist)of the regulations
Now, as you can see, traffic means a lot more then just selling. Hell, brining your bros gear over to his house or even offering to get some send to your house for him, ect brings you from possession to traffic. Remember that for later, that’ll change things considerably.
Steroids are “Schedule IV drugs”. Basically, Schedules are priority as far as the government is concerned, with Schedule I being the most dangerous drugs like cocaine and heroin, Schedule II including cannabis and it’s derivatives (this will change) and Schedule III being most of the other dangerous drugs such as amphetamines and LSD. “Schedule IV drugs” are drugs considered dangerous but also used for therapeutic reasons. Check out the list of steroids on “Schedule IV drugs”.
Schedule IV list
And for those who say “Great, I can just get an obscure steroid not on the list and buy and sell as I please”
Well, because of the phrase “anabolic steroids and their derivatives”, plus the lengthy list of steroids, which even includes such drugs as furazabol and clostebol, no can do. As well, the Governor General has the discretion to add and remove any thing he wants basically from the Schedules. This however, is more for the days when chemists would manufacture drugs like amphetamines slightly different chemically then listed. It is for this reason too that the phrase “and their derivatives, salts, isomers and analogues” are often beside the names of common drugs. This doesn't really have to do with steroids, though it does apply to them.
OK, so we have the terms and such out of the way. Now for actual offences, I need to teach you a bit about offences. Bare with me please, you'll learn alot. The CDSA is all criminal. The word offence means indictable or serious offence in other words, or summary offence, which is for less serious crimes is usually the discretion of the Crown and basically with summary offences they aren’t too serious compared to indictable offences. If you get off with a “slap on the wrist” then you were charged on summary conviction more then likely. However, because most crimes range in scope, you usually don’t see summary offences, but “dual or hybrid offences” in most Law. This means that the officer would arrest, charge and then send them to the Crown, where depending on the circumstances leading to the arrest they would either charge summary, which would be a fine and minimal jail time, or an indictable offence, which is serious stuff.
Here’s the kicker. Police have a lot more power if it’s an indictable offence and when something comes along that is a dual or hybrid offence they’ll treat it as if it’s indictable anyways, and thus scaring the shit outta you if it is something that would more then likely be summary.
Still with me?
Good, now that that's out of the way:
Here’s where everyone says steroids are legal. The CDSA doesn’t actually say that possessions of “Schedule IV drugs” are legal. They say that “(except as authorized) no person shall possess a substance in Schedule I, II or III” (CDSA, section 4)
That’s basically it. They’re saying that even if you don’t have authorization, mere possession by the definition above is basically not illegal. They aren’t really saying it’s legal, though in the editor’s notes on the former drug laws, it states
“As was the case under Part III of the Food and Drugs act, simple possession of Schedule IV drugs is not an offence” (not really important, just backing up that it never states it’s “legal”)
Note, there is a possession offence when it comes to “Schedule IV drugs” , just it’s not thought as possession but more fraud. Referred to as “double doctoring”, under CDSA section 4, it’s illegal to seek any scheduled drug from a doctor without telling him if you have been prescribed a scheduled drug in the last 30 days. If the Crown charges with indictable, it depends on the schedule the person attempted to “double doctor”, if by summary, the scheduled drug doesn’t matter. This sounds like something one would do to stock pile some test huh?
From here on in, any drug referred to I means a Schedule IV drug, unless specified
Now here’s where everything changes:
Trafficking- if you’re gonna get charged for anything steroid related in Canada, it’s probably some sort of trafficking
By definition, a lot is trafficking. Hell, talking about ordering them is technically trafficking.
Trafficking in substance: 1) No person shall traffic in a substance included in Schedule I,II,III,IV or in any substance represented or held out by that person to be such a substance (like fake stuff, good for the scamming bastards) (CDSA, section 5)
More specifically, where the subject matter of the offence is a substance included in Schedule IV,
i) is guilty of an indictable offence and liable to imprisonment for a term not exceeding three years, or
ii) is guilty of an offence punishable on summary conviction and liable to imprisonment for a term not exceeding one year (this basically means fines, probation etc.)
I know it sucks, but holding drugs for a friend, or not getting any payment and giving away juice is still trafficking, and it’s been tried many times (though not all for steroids, but other Schedule IV drugs).
Giving to a friend even to hold for safekeeping ISan offence.
Good news, for the purpose of transporting under trafficking, if it’s transportation for your use, then that’s not trafficking (i.e., you drive home to shoot up after buying the pins and the a cop finds 20 amps of sust, you can’t be nailed for trafficking, that’s possession, which isn't an offence! )....course, they can be seized, but more on that later.
Here are some more questions and scenarios that have come up with regards to trafficking Schedule IV drugs,
-You buy for someone else, it’s trafficking
-Your buddy tells you where you can get some, he is not charged with trafficking, but aiding and abetting the possession of a narcotic.
-If your buddy gets any profit or reward or physically brings you over and helps deal, it’s trafficking
-Joking to a cop about selling is trafficking
-If the person is trafficking and neither know it’s illegal, still trafficking
Importing and exporting: (CDSA, section 6)
“(except as authorized) no person shall import into Canada or export from Canada a substance included in Schedule I-IV. You may also not possess it for the purposes of exporting.
Now, everyone who does this and the drug is either Schedule III or IV
i) is guilty of an indictable offence and liable to prison for a term not exceeding ten years, or
ii) is guilty of a summary conviction and liable to a term not exceeding 18 months
So basically, if you are caught getting anything imported into Canada, you can be charged pretty heavy. Or if you get caught even sending a few amps of cyp to the US, you can still be charged heavily. However, you’d probably be charged on summary punishment if anything and again, that’s not as serious.
Production of a Substance: (CDSA, section 7)
“(except as authorized) no person shall produce a substance in Schedule I-IV”
Specifically Schedule IV : Guilty of an indictable offence not exceeding three years, or guilty of a summary offence not exceeding one year
So watch out, just making tren is illegal, and I believe that the pellets would technically be illegal for the purpose of importing/exporting, even comp Th, which you have to do to make tren as it is!
More Sentencing Stuff: (CDSA, section 10)
In relation to all the charges mentioned, if the offence was done carrying or using or threatening with a weapon, trafficked near or in a school/other places frequented by those under 18, or even in relation to a person under 18 years of age, the court can consider this an aggravating factor and impose more punishment. Oh, and importing something is considered an aggravating factor. That sucks. If you get nailed for trafficking and then they find it was imported, they can boost the punishment.
Seizures (CDSA, 11):
Here’s how they a cop can seize your gear legally, even if not to charge you. I’m gonna put this into layman’s terms cause otherwise, it’s pretty confusing.
BTW, peace officer means police officer. A justice who has been given written proof (called an information) that
a) any offence in the CDSA has been commited
b) any thing which a controlled substance or precursor referred to in the CDSA is contained or concealed
c) offence related property or anything that will afford evidence in respect of an offence under the CDSA is in a place and may be moved or destroyed may issue a warrant authorizing a peace officer, at any time, to search a place for any scheduled drug and to seize it.
So a cop needs to get a warrant if he has reasonable grounds (more then suspicion) that any offence in the CDSA is happening. If the warrant is for say cocaine (so you’re ****ed anyways) and he sees you in possession with steroids while executing the warrant, it doesn’t matter that’s possession isn’t illegal, he can still seize them cause they're scheduled (though you’re probably shitting about the cocaine, right?)
I’m not gonna get into warrants and stuff, cause a lot of it is really geared towards hard drugs, as most of the CDSA is, but basically, if he sees it and it’s a scheduled substance, he can seize it no questions asked, even if he can’t charge you with possession.
Oh, and a nice little tool cops can use is under the same section is subsection (7). Basically, if he has a reason to get a CDSA warrant and has reason to believe that taking the time to get a warrant would be “impracticable”, he can proceed with all the powers of having said warrant!! AND, there's no definition for impracticable in the whole Criminal Code AND if he's acting on "good faith", then it's tough to contest the search and seizure, unless there's major Freedom of Rights violations.
Now relax. Steroids are far from priority. Schedule I and II are the one's they're worried about, as they have the heaviest penalties (you can get 7 years for just possession of schedule I drugs, life for trafficking schedule I and II drugs). The fact that there are no actual possession laws technically for steroids or specifically Schedule IV drugs is a good indication it’s not priority. As well, trafficking schedule I and II drugs doesn’t even have a summary punishment, just indictable, where’s schedule IV carries with it both indictable and summary.
Trust me, if you do somehow get nailed with trafficking juice, you’ll probably get a fine or something, and lose your juice, unless you are distributing, or a “source” which is why they made it a dual offence to traffic steroids and other schedule IV drugs.
To actually nail you with one of these in a steroid related offence, you'd have to be "found committing" an offence first off. If not and the cop doesn't see you "commit the offence", he'd have to form reasonable grounds to believe an indictable ofence had occured or will occure. Well, I doubt any cop would take the time to go through what would likely be thrown out of court or at most a summary punishment. While researching this , I couldn't even find any steroid case law, which means that no one bothers to defend steroid charges here in Canada cause they get off lightly, are nailed heavily(distribution wise), the lose the case with no real defence or they accept a plea.
However, these laws are very real, and though your chances of getting nailed for 20 amps are pretty slim, let's look at how you could get charged.
Say you and friend talk about ordering from the chinaman for yourselves, and do so.
Well, right there, you've committed importing/exporting offences as well as trafficking offences. Say for some reason you or your buddy is under 18? Aggravatted offences, so more penalties. Plus the physical transfer of cash and the gear is trafficking.
Say you want to make some tren? Well, unless there's something I don't know, comp TH or tren pellets are in fact as listed in Schedule IV under "Anabolic Steroids and their derivatives -(43) Trenbolone"
So there you have importing, and mabe trafficking for buying it. Course, they could nail you with traficing if they wanted then use importation as an aggrivating factor....
Anyways, just be careful bros. Cause there are cops who know this stuff, just most either don't bother to learn or don't bother to enforce. You get caught with juice, you probably won't even get them seized, but remember, there's always a way for the government to get you, and besides, do you really want to supply some cops next cycle? :biglaugh:
Keep safe everyone, hope you learned something. And remember, steroids aren't legal in Canada.
The two biggest terms are
Possession: a) a person has anything in possession when he has it in his personal possessions or knowingly
i) has it in the actual possession or custody of another person, or
ii) has it in any place, whether or not that place belongs to or is occupied by him, for the use or benefit of himself or of another person; and
b) where one of two or more persons, with the knowledge and consent of the rest, has anything in his custody or possession, it shall be deemed to be in the custody and possession of each and all of them
Traffic: means in respect of a substance included in any of Schedules I to IV
a) to sell, administer, give, transfer, transport, send or deliver the substance, or
b) to sell an authorization to obtain the substance, or
c) to offer to do anything mentioned in paragraph a) or b)
otherwise than under the authority (doctor, pharmacist)of the regulations
Now, as you can see, traffic means a lot more then just selling. Hell, brining your bros gear over to his house or even offering to get some send to your house for him, ect brings you from possession to traffic. Remember that for later, that’ll change things considerably.
Steroids are “Schedule IV drugs”. Basically, Schedules are priority as far as the government is concerned, with Schedule I being the most dangerous drugs like cocaine and heroin, Schedule II including cannabis and it’s derivatives (this will change) and Schedule III being most of the other dangerous drugs such as amphetamines and LSD. “Schedule IV drugs” are drugs considered dangerous but also used for therapeutic reasons. Check out the list of steroids on “Schedule IV drugs”.
Schedule IV list
And for those who say “Great, I can just get an obscure steroid not on the list and buy and sell as I please”
Well, because of the phrase “anabolic steroids and their derivatives”, plus the lengthy list of steroids, which even includes such drugs as furazabol and clostebol, no can do. As well, the Governor General has the discretion to add and remove any thing he wants basically from the Schedules. This however, is more for the days when chemists would manufacture drugs like amphetamines slightly different chemically then listed. It is for this reason too that the phrase “and their derivatives, salts, isomers and analogues” are often beside the names of common drugs. This doesn't really have to do with steroids, though it does apply to them.
OK, so we have the terms and such out of the way. Now for actual offences, I need to teach you a bit about offences. Bare with me please, you'll learn alot. The CDSA is all criminal. The word offence means indictable or serious offence in other words, or summary offence, which is for less serious crimes is usually the discretion of the Crown and basically with summary offences they aren’t too serious compared to indictable offences. If you get off with a “slap on the wrist” then you were charged on summary conviction more then likely. However, because most crimes range in scope, you usually don’t see summary offences, but “dual or hybrid offences” in most Law. This means that the officer would arrest, charge and then send them to the Crown, where depending on the circumstances leading to the arrest they would either charge summary, which would be a fine and minimal jail time, or an indictable offence, which is serious stuff.
Here’s the kicker. Police have a lot more power if it’s an indictable offence and when something comes along that is a dual or hybrid offence they’ll treat it as if it’s indictable anyways, and thus scaring the shit outta you if it is something that would more then likely be summary.
Still with me?
Good, now that that's out of the way:
Here’s where everyone says steroids are legal. The CDSA doesn’t actually say that possessions of “Schedule IV drugs” are legal. They say that “(except as authorized) no person shall possess a substance in Schedule I, II or III” (CDSA, section 4)
That’s basically it. They’re saying that even if you don’t have authorization, mere possession by the definition above is basically not illegal. They aren’t really saying it’s legal, though in the editor’s notes on the former drug laws, it states
“As was the case under Part III of the Food and Drugs act, simple possession of Schedule IV drugs is not an offence” (not really important, just backing up that it never states it’s “legal”)
Note, there is a possession offence when it comes to “Schedule IV drugs” , just it’s not thought as possession but more fraud. Referred to as “double doctoring”, under CDSA section 4, it’s illegal to seek any scheduled drug from a doctor without telling him if you have been prescribed a scheduled drug in the last 30 days. If the Crown charges with indictable, it depends on the schedule the person attempted to “double doctor”, if by summary, the scheduled drug doesn’t matter. This sounds like something one would do to stock pile some test huh?
From here on in, any drug referred to I means a Schedule IV drug, unless specified
Now here’s where everything changes:
Trafficking- if you’re gonna get charged for anything steroid related in Canada, it’s probably some sort of trafficking
By definition, a lot is trafficking. Hell, talking about ordering them is technically trafficking.
Trafficking in substance: 1) No person shall traffic in a substance included in Schedule I,II,III,IV or in any substance represented or held out by that person to be such a substance (like fake stuff, good for the scamming bastards) (CDSA, section 5)
More specifically, where the subject matter of the offence is a substance included in Schedule IV,
i) is guilty of an indictable offence and liable to imprisonment for a term not exceeding three years, or
ii) is guilty of an offence punishable on summary conviction and liable to imprisonment for a term not exceeding one year (this basically means fines, probation etc.)
I know it sucks, but holding drugs for a friend, or not getting any payment and giving away juice is still trafficking, and it’s been tried many times (though not all for steroids, but other Schedule IV drugs).
Giving to a friend even to hold for safekeeping ISan offence.
Good news, for the purpose of transporting under trafficking, if it’s transportation for your use, then that’s not trafficking (i.e., you drive home to shoot up after buying the pins and the a cop finds 20 amps of sust, you can’t be nailed for trafficking, that’s possession, which isn't an offence! )....course, they can be seized, but more on that later.
Here are some more questions and scenarios that have come up with regards to trafficking Schedule IV drugs,
-You buy for someone else, it’s trafficking
-Your buddy tells you where you can get some, he is not charged with trafficking, but aiding and abetting the possession of a narcotic.
-If your buddy gets any profit or reward or physically brings you over and helps deal, it’s trafficking
-Joking to a cop about selling is trafficking
-If the person is trafficking and neither know it’s illegal, still trafficking
Importing and exporting: (CDSA, section 6)
“(except as authorized) no person shall import into Canada or export from Canada a substance included in Schedule I-IV. You may also not possess it for the purposes of exporting.
Now, everyone who does this and the drug is either Schedule III or IV
i) is guilty of an indictable offence and liable to prison for a term not exceeding ten years, or
ii) is guilty of a summary conviction and liable to a term not exceeding 18 months
So basically, if you are caught getting anything imported into Canada, you can be charged pretty heavy. Or if you get caught even sending a few amps of cyp to the US, you can still be charged heavily. However, you’d probably be charged on summary punishment if anything and again, that’s not as serious.
Production of a Substance: (CDSA, section 7)
“(except as authorized) no person shall produce a substance in Schedule I-IV”
Specifically Schedule IV : Guilty of an indictable offence not exceeding three years, or guilty of a summary offence not exceeding one year
So watch out, just making tren is illegal, and I believe that the pellets would technically be illegal for the purpose of importing/exporting, even comp Th, which you have to do to make tren as it is!
More Sentencing Stuff: (CDSA, section 10)
In relation to all the charges mentioned, if the offence was done carrying or using or threatening with a weapon, trafficked near or in a school/other places frequented by those under 18, or even in relation to a person under 18 years of age, the court can consider this an aggravating factor and impose more punishment. Oh, and importing something is considered an aggravating factor. That sucks. If you get nailed for trafficking and then they find it was imported, they can boost the punishment.
Seizures (CDSA, 11):
Here’s how they a cop can seize your gear legally, even if not to charge you. I’m gonna put this into layman’s terms cause otherwise, it’s pretty confusing.
BTW, peace officer means police officer. A justice who has been given written proof (called an information) that
a) any offence in the CDSA has been commited
b) any thing which a controlled substance or precursor referred to in the CDSA is contained or concealed
c) offence related property or anything that will afford evidence in respect of an offence under the CDSA is in a place and may be moved or destroyed may issue a warrant authorizing a peace officer, at any time, to search a place for any scheduled drug and to seize it.
So a cop needs to get a warrant if he has reasonable grounds (more then suspicion) that any offence in the CDSA is happening. If the warrant is for say cocaine (so you’re ****ed anyways) and he sees you in possession with steroids while executing the warrant, it doesn’t matter that’s possession isn’t illegal, he can still seize them cause they're scheduled (though you’re probably shitting about the cocaine, right?)
I’m not gonna get into warrants and stuff, cause a lot of it is really geared towards hard drugs, as most of the CDSA is, but basically, if he sees it and it’s a scheduled substance, he can seize it no questions asked, even if he can’t charge you with possession.
Oh, and a nice little tool cops can use is under the same section is subsection (7). Basically, if he has a reason to get a CDSA warrant and has reason to believe that taking the time to get a warrant would be “impracticable”, he can proceed with all the powers of having said warrant!! AND, there's no definition for impracticable in the whole Criminal Code AND if he's acting on "good faith", then it's tough to contest the search and seizure, unless there's major Freedom of Rights violations.
Now relax. Steroids are far from priority. Schedule I and II are the one's they're worried about, as they have the heaviest penalties (you can get 7 years for just possession of schedule I drugs, life for trafficking schedule I and II drugs). The fact that there are no actual possession laws technically for steroids or specifically Schedule IV drugs is a good indication it’s not priority. As well, trafficking schedule I and II drugs doesn’t even have a summary punishment, just indictable, where’s schedule IV carries with it both indictable and summary.
Trust me, if you do somehow get nailed with trafficking juice, you’ll probably get a fine or something, and lose your juice, unless you are distributing, or a “source” which is why they made it a dual offence to traffic steroids and other schedule IV drugs.
To actually nail you with one of these in a steroid related offence, you'd have to be "found committing" an offence first off. If not and the cop doesn't see you "commit the offence", he'd have to form reasonable grounds to believe an indictable ofence had occured or will occure. Well, I doubt any cop would take the time to go through what would likely be thrown out of court or at most a summary punishment. While researching this , I couldn't even find any steroid case law, which means that no one bothers to defend steroid charges here in Canada cause they get off lightly, are nailed heavily(distribution wise), the lose the case with no real defence or they accept a plea.
However, these laws are very real, and though your chances of getting nailed for 20 amps are pretty slim, let's look at how you could get charged.
Say you and friend talk about ordering from the chinaman for yourselves, and do so.
Well, right there, you've committed importing/exporting offences as well as trafficking offences. Say for some reason you or your buddy is under 18? Aggravatted offences, so more penalties. Plus the physical transfer of cash and the gear is trafficking.
Say you want to make some tren? Well, unless there's something I don't know, comp TH or tren pellets are in fact as listed in Schedule IV under "Anabolic Steroids and their derivatives -(43) Trenbolone"
So there you have importing, and mabe trafficking for buying it. Course, they could nail you with traficing if they wanted then use importation as an aggrivating factor....
Anyways, just be careful bros. Cause there are cops who know this stuff, just most either don't bother to learn or don't bother to enforce. You get caught with juice, you probably won't even get them seized, but remember, there's always a way for the government to get you, and besides, do you really want to supply some cops next cycle? :biglaugh:
Keep safe everyone, hope you learned something. And remember, steroids aren't legal in Canada.
