winny/antiestrogen
- Thread starter quadzilla
- Start date
a) trenbolone, deca, and friends cannot increase progesterone production and are very likely to decrease it.
b) trenbolone does indeed bind to the progesterone receptor:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/...ve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=11252818
c) once there, trenbolone has jackshit activity, just like winstrol, and is a good anti-progestin on its own:
http://www.obgynsurvey.com/pt/re/obgynsurv/abstract.00006254-200410000-00012.htm
"In contrast, gestrinone and trenbolone had much less progestin activity than progesterone."
take three deep breaths. you'll be fine.
b) trenbolone does indeed bind to the progesterone receptor:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/...ve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=11252818
c) once there, trenbolone has jackshit activity, just like winstrol, and is a good anti-progestin on its own:
http://www.obgynsurvey.com/pt/re/obgynsurv/abstract.00006254-200410000-00012.htm
"In contrast, gestrinone and trenbolone had much less progestin activity than progesterone."
take three deep breaths. you'll be fine.
Bignick
New member
i have heard mixed opinions....but i feel that winny from experience is very anti progestenic.....i have some gyno and it was milky too....running about a gram of test a week has had no effect on my nips.....winny and nolva.....thats it bro....so i dont know...could be lucky...but i really do think the winny works
Cannons
New member
Tren and deca have been known to increase prolactin levels which causes the formation of excess progesterone. If estrogen levels are high as well (aromatization of test), together they cause progesterone induced gyno (milky or rusty looking fluid from nipples and sometimes hard, painful lumps). Usually tren or deca by themselves will not cause gyno because progesterone isn't a strong enough hormone to start gyno, but coupled together with estrogen it is. Winstrol binds to progesterone receptors. Dostinex and Bromocriptine lower prolactin levels, ceasing the ability for progesterone to form and work together with estrogen (from aromatized test) and form gyno. The whole point of the matter is to know your body and keep all hormones at a certain level. Test, Estrogen, Prolactin and progesterone all have a place and function in the male body, some more than others. This is why blood testing is important, and why its important to know how your body reacts to AAS so you can be proactive instead of reactive. I have gotten all of the info above from personal experience, medical studies as well as endocrinologists (sp) who have experimented with AAS themselves. I believe the above information to be as true as I could have gotten at the time which was a few months ago.
Cannons said:
nope, unless you know of studies which directly contradict these.
using nandrolone, no difference in prolactin levels:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=2805460&dopt=Abstract
using trenbolone, no difference in prolactin levels:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=7017853&dopt=Abstract
androgens just don't affect serum prolactin levels in adult males:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=7165125&dopt=Abstract
Cannons
New member
Marble said:
Interesting. That is hard for me to believe since I've gotten gyno from tren while running it with high levels of test. Leaky, puffy nipples, no lumps (had some lumps from previous gyno) with no relief from nolvadex. So my question to you is, how do you get it? If tren or deca do not affect prolactin levels (which I'm having a hard time believing) then how do you explain gyno with lactation? I'm asking you this strictly for knowledge, I'm not trying to prove a point or prove you wrong. We find out new things everyday about this stuff, and I may be behind the power curve a little. I want to know this information....
yeah i was going to reply to marble the same thing cannon,, cuase i used tren before just by its self with no sides,, but with deca adn test i had serious sides,, then i stopped for a good 6 months,, and with pre existing gyno just 3 ccs if tren got me a serious increase in tissue, adn tren is related to deca, and deca has been proven to bring about gyno from progestrigen just like anadrol,,,
Bignick
New member
marble is right in some sense...on paper marble is right, but i dont believe that this is totally true.....i have seen several studies suggest that neither raise prolactin or induce gyyno.....its a questionable topic....i would say that both opinions have valid reasoning and until more research is done i am going to say im stuck on the fence .....MARBLE GOOD INFO BRO
hey, no prob bro, glad to contribute some research on the matter. 
hyperprolactinemia can certainly cause gyno. progesterone-induced gynecomastia is extremely unlikely in our population, and deca is the only commonly used steroid that would have a chance of causing it. trenbolone, again, would prevent it, as would winny.
i don't doubt people have had these problems at all. what i think is far more likely is that the deca or tren uncovers an underlying endocrine imbalance that was already there in these individuals, kinda like slin will make some people quickly go diabetic, while others can use for years and go off just fine. small pituitary tumors making prolactin are incredibly common.
another indirect effect that could be responsible for this in vulnerable users would be megadoses of strong androgens(like tren) causing hypothyroidism in these individuals. all androgens shut down your thyroid to some degree, which in turn could lead to overproduction of prolactin at very high doses and possibly said lactation. that'd be a good explanation in addition to pre-existing hyperprolactinemia which they never noticed.
does anyone else find it hard to post while there's a puking smiley to their left? :embarrass
hyperprolactinemia can certainly cause gyno. progesterone-induced gynecomastia is extremely unlikely in our population, and deca is the only commonly used steroid that would have a chance of causing it. trenbolone, again, would prevent it, as would winny.i don't doubt people have had these problems at all. what i think is far more likely is that the deca or tren uncovers an underlying endocrine imbalance that was already there in these individuals, kinda like slin will make some people quickly go diabetic, while others can use for years and go off just fine. small pituitary tumors making prolactin are incredibly common.
another indirect effect that could be responsible for this in vulnerable users would be megadoses of strong androgens(like tren) causing hypothyroidism in these individuals. all androgens shut down your thyroid to some degree, which in turn could lead to overproduction of prolactin at very high doses and possibly said lactation. that'd be a good explanation in addition to pre-existing hyperprolactinemia which they never noticed.
does anyone else find it hard to post while there's a puking smiley to their left? :embarrass
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